Jota starter motor

Thanks for all the tips on starter motors everyone. Mine has been over spun, hence the copper debri dropping out. I have taken mine dismantled to a branch of Carwood & Brise, which is quite close to me, they didn’t, condem it immediately, which is promising, but I haven’t had a full quote yet. 🤞🤞
 
Hi 'GrumpyD',

I've also shared details with our mutual acquaintance Paul Lund about a spare starter motor, in the event that yours isn't rebuildable.

Alan 😊
 
Oh Dear, Carwood have said they cannot get the parts for mine, but offered to bin it. Luckily I managed to convince them not to. Phew
Enquires now ongoing with The Starter Bay in Gloucester. a bit closer than robinson and francis.
 
you prompted me to take my spare starter to the starter bay, they opened it up everything is like new in there. They bench tested it and all seems well. I had the motor from another member who had it rebuilt, but when mounted to the bike it wont spin it over . starter bay noticed a blob of weld on the shaft, don't know if that is the cause, anyway I've got it back home and no charge from them for investigating
 
GrumpyD said:
Oh Dear, Carwood have said they cannot get the parts for mine, but offered to bin it. Luckily I managed to convince them not to. Phew
Enquires now ongoing with The Starter Bay in Gloucester. a bit closer than robinson and francis.
Click to expand...
Piet had some internals available a while ago and Alan Bell supplied me with individual used parts recently too.
 
a14rgs said:
Hi 'GrumpyD',

I've also shared details with our mutual acquaintance Paul Lund about a spare starter motor, in the event that yours isn't rebuildable.

Alan 😊
Click to expand...
Hello Alan. Unexpectedly I find myself in Chippenham. Are you at home this morning so I can check out your starter motor please.
Internet shaky. Could you reply on WhatsApp my mobile 07970120076.
Thanks GrumpyD
 
I bought a motor from Blue Traction like Paul ( he calls it Blue Motion but that's a VAG car thing ) mine had the bendix on it and had no gear. My existing gear from the RGS went straight on and I then _ being aware of what happened to Paul - used two nuts, the original Aeroquip locking type and a slim lock nut to really lock it up tight, prevent the bendix from operating and secure the gear in place, it's worked reliably for a couple of years since. the problem was the way the motor was constructed the nuts were at the gasket end of the motor making it difficult to seal and I had a constant oil leak from the joint between motor and casing I had to make a plate which aligned the gears better and sealed the gap far better. However I notice that Blue Traction now do a motor for Laverdas which is red, comes with a new gear ( though I had a feeling my old gear was 13 tooth! not 14 better experts will be able to confirm or deny this ) and is designed correctly for the gasket joint as well. for a 120 model at least this appears to be the one you want. If you need a bendix there is one on the same page as this on their site never had a Jota so can't speak with authority on that.laverda starter.jpeg
 
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I was recently looking at Spanish Sanglas owners solutions to this problem, their bikes have an identical looking starter.
I thought I'd cracked it with a £40 Seadoo motor they have modified to suit but unfortunately the motor turns in the opposite direction to the Laverda one.
 
Rokka said:
I bought a motor from Blue Traction like Paul ( he calls it Blue Motion but that's a VAG car thing ) mine had the bendix on it and had no gear. My existing gear from the RGS went straight on and I then _ being aware of what happened to Paul - used two nuts, the original Aeroquip locking type and a slim lock nut to really lock it up tight, prevent the bendix from operating and secure the gear in place, it's worked reliably for a couple of years since. the problem was the way the motor was constructed the nuts were at the gasket end of the motor making it difficult to seal and I had a constant oil leak from the joint between motor and casing I had to make a plate which aligned the gears better and sealed the gap far better. However I notice that Blue Traction now do a motor for Laverdas which is red, comes with a new gear ( though I had a feeling my old gear was 13 tooth! not 14 better experts will be able to confirm or deny this ) and is designed correctly for the gasket joint as well. for a 120 model at least this appears to be the one you want. If you need a bendix there is one on the same page as this on their site never had a Jota so can't speak with authority on that.View attachment 97363
Click to expand...
I used this starter motor.
newstore.bluetraction.eu

MO102LB

Laverda 350 500 750
newstore.bluetraction.eu newstore.bluetraction.eu
The problem I had was that the part holding the gear was simply pinned onto the shaft. After two or 3 starts, the pin sheared, the gears didn't mesh properly and chewed themselves up.
1750594556136.jpeg1750594594131.jpeg1750594614700.jpeg1750594649583.jpeg
I contacted the company at the time who answered but didn't understand the problem, so I explained again. Then they didn't answer.
Paul
 
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Paul Marx said:
I used this starter motor.
newstore.bluetraction.eu

MO102LB

Laverda 350 500 750
newstore.bluetraction.eu newstore.bluetraction.eu
The problem I had was that the part holding the gear was simply pinned onto the shaft. After two or 3 starts, the pin sheared, the gears didn't mesh properly and chewed themselves up.
Click to expand...
That's what I thought, Though that's the 400w and I thought you said they sent you the 600w one: The one they sent me was the 600w motor but it had exactly the same shaft arrangement.The pin can only shear however if rotational or extending torque is exerted on it, and that can only happen if the bendix is allowed to extend and the bendix can only extend if the nut on the central shaft running inside the splined collar allows it to, which is why I put two nuts on that central shaft to lock it tight. That holds the gear hard against the collar, and that holds the collar hard against the base of the shaft and as the splines on each are intermeshed there is then no possibility of rotation without extension and therefore no force on the pin. In fact the motor does the job even if the pin is removed as long as the end nuts are absolutely secure. That single slim nut you've pictured on the end of your shaft really doesn't look up to the job, looking at the amount of thread on the end of the shaft in your last picture and looking at the amount of it protruding from the nut in your third picture, the nut doesn't look far enough up the threads to absolutely stop the collar moving. I managed to get 2 nuts on the end of that shaft. I also noted the slight mis-alignment of the two gears ( though mine wasn't as bad as yours as I had screwed the nuts right up ) when the motor was fitted and made a plate of 6mm aluminium to go between the motor and the casing to set the motor back and align the gears better. Obviously I had your report of your misfortune to pre-warn me of the possible problem, but I have had no problems. pic shows the two nuts and the face plate on the front of the motor.IMG_7616.JPG
Hopefully the new improved Laverda motor from Bluetraction will have none of these issues, but if it does in my experience they are fairly easily solved if you are forewarned.
 
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It is a 600 W motor I have. Much more friendly with the freewheel than the tired original starter I had.
The nut, or nuts, blocks the gear carrier, but that bendix type spiral is pushing outwards against the pin.
Turning off that spiral and making up a tight fitting bush might make the system more reliable.
Paul
 
I have to disagree Paul. It can't just be pushing against the pin, it should be pushing against the nuts and the pin and the nuts are the stronger of the two. If the nuts are tight and can not work loose the pin is superfluous. The slightest loosness however will result in the outer sleeve hammering into it ( and the pin ) every time the bike is started. When I read your original post a good while ago and looked at my own new starter I thought immediately that the nut was the potential problem more than the pin; as long as it can't move outward on them the spiral splines actually lock the sleeve and the shaft together and make it more secure against rotation than any bush could. Even an interferance fit bush can rotate in high torque situations unless secured by a woodruff key or similar and I've seen a few of those shear over the years.
 
Rokka said:
I have to disagree Paul. It can't just be pushing against the pin, it should be pushing against the nuts and the pin and the nuts are the stronger of the two. If the nuts are tight and can not work loose the pin is superfluous. The slightest loosness however will result in the outer sleeve hammering into it ( and the pin ) every time the bike is started. When I read your original post a good while ago and looked at my own new starter I thought immediately that the nut was the potential problem more than the pin; as long as it can't move outward on them the spiral splines actually lock the sleeve and the shaft together and make it more secure against rotation than any bush could. Even an interferance fit bush can rotate in high torque situations unless secured by a woodruff key or similar and I've seen a few of those shear over the years.
Click to expand...
You're very likely right.
I hope that I've kept all the bits so as to check, since looking at my photos, I'm not sure that I could have double nutted it.
Paul
 
I've found the bits.
I'm not sure that I could put two nuts on there.
I think I have spare gears somewhere. I might try it when I have an engine.
1750673390308.jpeg
Paul
 
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looking at your photo I see your point! There doesn't seem to be as much of the thread on the shaft protruding as on mine and even though yours also purports to be a 600w model It doesn't appear to have the same indents in the face plate as mine either ( see my photo ) which were a pain and caused it to leak till I made the 6mm plate go on the front of it but in the end causing me to do that made the gears allign much better. I think I may have knocked the pin out of mine allowing the tightening of the nuts to force the outer back on the splines till it was absolutely wedged as solid as possible. in addition to that the nut off my original starter was a more substantial one than yours, it's the inner one of the two shown, it's a flanged nut with a slightly squeezed thread like the aeroquip style locking nuts.
 
Paul,

I think I see flats on the shaft, in this case the gear used on the SJCM starters might fit straight on and no pin will be required. Just a single lock nut.

piet
 
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