Laverda Corse at Croatia

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noneglibob

Guest
Laverda Corse had a mixed bag of results at the Rijeka track in Croatia last weekend. First the good news; Francesco Greggio and Pietro Manzalini riding Pietro's F500 came 7th overall in the 325KM race. This was an excellent result because they were the smallest capacity bike remaining in the race , all the other bikes were 750cc and above. Now the bad bit;

I'd brought my new race bike along for its debut endurance meeting and , despite running like a train in qualifying and showing great promise after a storming start by Piero, the bike was sidelined by an ignition problem just 7 laps into the race. Obviously I was bitterly disappointed but due to a simultaneous ignition failure and rear wheel puncture we were going out of the race one way or another.
The ignition fault was down a poorly manufactured trigger/rotor unit, something I'd spotted when first installing the Sachse ignition.  The plan was to have a new one made to a better design but just didn't have the time to attend to it before the race. It had completed 10 hours of testing and so I felt it would be OK .  It wasn't..... :sad: If a bike's got a week point an endurance race will find it out. Mind you, if the ignition hadn't ended our race the puncture certainly would have, possibly with more drastic consequences.

Rijeka is a fantastic venue with a full GP length track, it has no modern concessions to speed restrictions such as the chicanes which plague so many circuits nowadays and is a good old fashioned riders circuit requiring balls and brains in equal measures. The scenery is incredible, the people are great and despite the setback we had a wonderful weekend . The new racer is very fast indeed and qualifying in the rain provided some daunting moments. Rijeka has two very fast straights where the bike was pulling 8000 rpm on long gearing, I haven't done the maths yet but I'm guessing the speed was close to 130mph. Next season should see us hit the ground running with the new machine and we hope to bring in some good results. Meanwhile we have one race left at Francaciorta in October.

Here's a few pics from the weekend;

1] Where it all began; Piero is standing outside the garage in the grounds of his family's old villa where the very first Laverda was built by his father. The property is being developed and it may well be that this historic landmark disappears in the next few years. It'll be a great shame if it does

2] The bike basking in the Italian afternoon sunshine sporting its nice new paddock stands

3] Lined up outside the pit alongside a Honda 750 raced by friends of Giovanni Laverda. Note the scenery in the background

4] Starting line up for the Le Mans style start. Piero did a sneaky 2nd gear start and gained 7 places by the end of the first straight. The torque of the Atlas engine has many advantages!

5] We drove home over the Alps and found that tackling the Stelvio pass in a fully laden van was equally as scary as Rijeka circuit, in fact more so! Big respect to those of you who have ridden the pass on past pilgrimages to Breganze. It's a road which will punish the over-enthusiastic rider or driver quite severely. This view is taken from the summit of the pass and you can see the pass snaking down the valley on the left. After this we drove down to St. Moritz and home through France

PS I should add that I'm very pleased with the Sachse ignition, the problem with the rotor may well be specific to the Atlas crank, or even specific to my Atlas crank. On my engine [it might differ on others] the rotor wasn't a snug fit on the crank and needed a deeper recess to allow the rotor to butt up to a shoulder on the crank. Without this support the rotor was able to vibrate loose [despite copious amounts of Loctite and a spring washer to secure it] and eventually it chaffed away the locating spigot and the ignition timing was lost


 

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Bob,
Sounds like a great trip,pity about your beasts probs but 7th for FG/Pm is fab! Don't suppose much can be done about punctures,was it from the pit lane perhaps? No doubt Red will have a view to fixing rotor prob,what was org fitment-was it the bosch system? Anyway bet your italian has improved esp swear words/phrases!
cheers will
 

redax5

Administrator
Staff member
Hey Will,
No views from me on the 500/600 system's I'm afraid, they are manufactured by Volker in Germany.
I don't have anything to do with them manufacturing wise.
Only systems I make are the Series 1 units with the alternator upgrade.
I have quite a number of the 500 systems at home though so am interested in what Bob or Volker come up with as a fix.

Tchau
Red
 
S

Scrumpyjack

Guest
Bob
Thanks for the pics. Your bike is looking great. Shame about the outcome but I'm sure as you iron out the teething problems the results will come.

Scrumpy
 
L

lemonjelly

Guest
Great shots Bob,sure you will storm it next time,is there an 'Italian Heritage' for the villa/garage or new ILOC HQ.Stunning scenery in bike and land.

Lemon
 
N

noneglibob

Guest
Fixing the ignition problem shouldn't present too many difficulties, in fact all it needs a deeper recess milling into the back of the trigger rotor..... having said that,I think I'll probably go for a slightly more involved fix and am investigating the possibility of using  Hall Effect triggers from a Suzuki coupled with a more sturdy fabricated backplate with a decent range of timing adjustment . I'm also hoping to make up a detachable plate with some strobe marks on it .
The reason for using Suzuki triggers is because they are cheap, good quality and readily available and I can keep a spare set in case of crash damage. As I said previously, there's nothing fundamentally wrong with Sachse unit. I'm running an engine with no balancer shaft at relatively high sustained rpm, this is a much harsher environment than the the unit would normally operate in and I'm sure this contributed to the problem.

Shaun , I'm afraid there are no plans [as far as I know] to preserve the historic Laverda garage although I'm told there are ideas being mooted around Breganze for a Laverda museum.
 

redax5

Administrator
Staff member
Hey Bob,
You could use your original Rotor for the Bosch unit and machine a recess on the back end of that.
Then machine a suitable bore in the Sachse Rotor and install it direct onto the modified Bosch rotor.
Than way you get a snug fit with a keyway and once you have the timing marks worked out you could lock the Sachse Magnetic rotor onto the keyed carrier.

Just a thought.

You never answered me on the 500 Conrod's, I'll send you another e-mail tonight.
Tchau
Red
 

phil37

Hero member
Location
Lincolnshire
Hi Bob - Shame about the ignition - it's always annoying when you've spotted something that's not quite right and are not able to fully fix it. Good result from rest of team - looks like you had a good time anyway. I've got some non standard ignition mounting plates and rotors that may save you some work - you're welcome to a couple - give me a bell if you want some - Regards - Phil
 
N

noneglibob

Guest
Hi Red,
I'd like to use the original rotor because I think it's an excellent design, I also think it's weight acts as a damper and reduces its susceptibility to vibes. Unfortunately the Atlas crank is slightly different to the standard 500 and there isn't enough meat on the flange which butts up to the rotor to mount the decent sized locating pin which is found on a standard 500 rotor. The Atlas's retaining pin is a feeble thing [presumably because it had to fit in the space available on the small flange]. The Sachse rotor has a milled slot for this pin and this was the root of the problem. I'm willing to bet a standard Sachse 500 fitment  on a 500 motor wouldn't have caused any problems. To be fair to Volker he wouldn't have been anticipating an Atlas motor would be subjected to such extreme use!
Finding this stuff out is all part of the game, unfortunately this time it took a 2500 mile round trip to find it! :D  

Phil, Thanks for the offer of the plates, they sound like they might be just the job and will give me an excuse to make a long overdue trip to the Wolds :D
I'll give you a call later.
 

MarnixSFC

Hero member
Bob,

Shit happens.. the Rijeka track used to be a bit dilapidated with the odd stone on the track, has it improved?

Stelvio: If you climb over that fence you see these hairpins. The Umbrail pass at the other side in direction of Bormio is less spectacular but fantastic.. 

Marnix
 

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nealebms

Hero member
Location
kent uk
hi
spent five days at interlaken two years ago,just going out every day doing two to three different passes every day,did stelvio one day stopped at top tee shirt weather,two days later a friend on his pan was comming to meet us and could'nt get over because of snow.eight weeks later looked at live webcam at top where all the little shops are that sell postcards and the snow was upto the first floor windows.best fun was comming down the susten pass(i think)and wondering why some locals were picknicking on a bend,got down to them and the road changed from tarmac to gravel right on the bend where they were sitting,bet there entertainment was watching the bikers faces,just ease off ,no sudden movements and hold your line and pray,went to slovinia with new tyres,did passes for five days needed new rear tyre at baden baden on way home,brilliant  :evil: :wink:
 

DavidH

Senior member
Great photos Bob.

Would love to hear the 500 with that mega exhaust.  As you say, finding the little niggles is just part of racing or being a Lav owner.  I'm happy you think the standard motors will handle the Sachse OK as I have one from Red and Max to fit when Alpino finally arrives.

Stelvio photos bring back the day we met Marco Pantani and two of his team mates climbing (on treadlies) the Stelvio back in the late 90's.  The other two were happy to stop for a break, but Marco kept at it until the top well over an hour later. Some training climb, no backup car, just the 3 cyclists and a heap of food and gear stuffed in their back pockets plus 3 bidons each. We got some fabulous photos of them climbing as well as at the top, but the hi-lite was them heading off back down.  If you think the run downhill is stupendous on a Lav, you should have seen these guys on bicycles descending, it was truly amazing as the speed was breath taking.
 

VanguardontheLav

Hero member
Location
Cambridge, UK
DavidH said:
If you think the Stelvio run downhill is stupendous on a Lav, you should have seen these guys on bicycles descending, it was truly amazing as the speed was breath taking.

Indeed - one of the buggers overtook me on my way down earlier this year - they have no fear! (or no brakes :) ) Talking of which, we met a guy with a 1960 Alfa Giulietta Spider at the bottom, whose (drum) brakes had failed half way down. Managed to stop it on the umbrella handbrake... He was changing his trousers...

--
Dick
 

Mingh

Hero member
DavidH said:
If you think the run downhill is stupendous on a Lav, you should have seen these guys on bicycles descending, it was truly amazing as the speed was breath taking.

And those are either poofs or they've got a mechanical problem. riding downhill on the road is easy and actually rather boring unless you're racing your mates. I spent numerous summers in the alps, canada and australia riding downhill racetracks, double black tracks. Now there's a gigle. Try youtubing the champery or maribor worldcup DH track to get a taste.
Thing is that a decent downhill bike has much better brakes and suspension than most motorbikes. I've got 10 inches of custom shimmed Ohlins controlled rear travel on my DH bike, not on my jota. With less than 5 kilos for wheels and tyres you put it in the next turn with your pink
 
N

noneglibob

Guest
Thing is, compared to a road bike your downhill bike won't go very fast on tarmac! And it will be very , very slow going up :D :D
 

laverdakeith

Hero member
Mingh said:
DavidH said:
If you think the run downhill is stupendous on a Lav, you should have seen these guys on bicycles descending, it was truly amazing as the speed was breath taking.

And those are either poofs or they've got a mechanical problem. riding downhill on the road is easy and actually rather boring unless you're racing your mates. I spent numerous summers in the alps, canada and australia riding downhill racetracks, double black tracks. Now there's a gigle. Try youtubing the champery or maribor worldcup DH track to get a taste.
Thing is that a decent downhill bike has much better brakes and suspension than most motorbikes. I've got 10 inches of custom shimmed Ohlins controlled rear travel on my DH bike, not on my jota. With less than 5 kilos for wheels and tyres you put it in the next turn with your pink

  Extreme freewheeling?  :undecided:

    Keith

 
 
S

Scrumpyjack

Guest
Mingh said:
DavidH said:
If you think the run downhill is stupendous on a Lav, you should have seen these guys on bicycles descending, it was truly amazing as the speed was breath taking.

And those are either poofs or they've got a mechanical problem. riding downhill on the road is easy and actually rather boring unless you're racing your mates. I spent numerous summers in the alps, canada and australia riding downhill racetracks, double black tracks. Now there's a gigle. Try youtubing the champery or maribor worldcup DH track to get a taste.
Thing is that a decent downhill bike has much better brakes and suspension than most motorbikes. I've got 10 inches of custom shimmed Ohlins controlled rear travel on my DH bike, not on my jota. With less than 5 kilos for wheels and tyres you put it in the next turn with your pink

Having descended the side of a hill at 50mph + in a pair of shorts, t-shirt and little esle on a bycicle with 15mm tyres I dont think I would call them poofs. Gravel rash at that speed would render you a little worse for wear, dont know anything about the champery or maribor but watching the tour de france you have to have some respect for those guys.

Scrumpy
 
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