UKs oldest motorcycle shop closes after 120 years..

[sfcpiet]

The bike shops still here are really sales outlets for new and a few used bikes, and accessories, besides the workshop. If you want parts you order them, the shop then orders them, and you go back and collect them, maybe find out they are wrong and go through the process again. Or you order online from a detailed parts list from somewhere that has them in stock and get them in a few days. It is the same for car parts from major dealers, don't even have a spare parts counter as reception handles it on the computer. The last genuine bike shop here, MC Artikler, closed over a decade ago, could chat with the helpful blokes who worked there and every time I went there I met people I knew and had a catch up. The modernists are hoping they can close every type of shop (even clothes, food etc) in this brave new world of online, a great pity.

And also extremely difficult to find someone experienced enough to offer tech advice, despite the diplomas on the wall behind them. I was searching for some older H-D odds and sods recently, all I got at the "parts" counter was an empty stare and a shrug of shoulders... but the showroom was bursting with shiny new bikes and maybe a half-dozen employees wandering around waiting to bait you.

Their own fault if retailers let the online shops flush them down the drain. Maybe there isn't "enough" money to warrant properly schooled staff, people that can actually answer a query, at the parts counters, but all they'll be seeing is the backs of their digusted customers as they walk out.

piet

 

[Paul Marx]

And also extremely difficult to find someone experienced enough to offer tech advice, despite the diplomas on the wall behind them. I was searching for some older H-D odds and sods recently, all I got at the "parts" counter was an empty stare and a shrug of shoulders... but the showroom was bursting with shiny new bikes and maybe a half-dozen employees wandering around waiting to bait you.

Their own fault if retailers let the online shops flush them down the drain. Maybe there isn't "enough" money to warrant properly schooled staff, people that can actually answer a query, at the parts counters, but all they'll be seeing is the backs of their digusted customers as they walk out.

piet

The Chinese will change all that.
Paul

 

[Exmoor beast]

And also extremely difficult to find someone experienced enough to offer tech advice, despite the diplomas on the wall behind them. I was searching for some older H-D odds and sods recently, all I got at the "parts" counter was an empty stare and a shrug of shoulders... but the showroom was bursting with shiny new bikes and maybe a half-dozen employees wandering around waiting to bait you.

Their own fault if retailers let the online shops flush them down the drain. Maybe there isn't "enough" money to warrant properly schooled staff, people that can actually answer a query, at the parts counters, but all they'll be seeing is the backs of their digusted customers as they walk out.

piet

Unfortunately, you don’t need an experienced Tech to PDI bikes that will be rented until balloon payment is due. Older H-D stuff is now catered for by a couple of places in UK, modern H-D dealers wouldn’t touch anything pre Evo. Back in the 80’s my old shop carried huge amounts of spares - we boasted we stocked every chain & sprocket & brake pad/ shoe available, literally filled our cellar. Mail order chain & sprockets killed that by undercutting us, probably with lower grade chain etc. I should think half of out trade back then was spares/ accessories - now that would be next to nothing. Interestingly, I am involved in Lambretta’s now- my local shop has almost 100% spares availability, every accessory under the sun, encyclopaedic knowledge and the older scoot you turn up on the more excited they get. Full workshop and advice.
The difference is the scooter brigade still use them, work on them, wear them out & spend money !

 

[Andy J]

It certainly could become an issue for more owners of bikes that are maybe only 10-20 years old and the manufacturers/sales companies not providing a spares and service back-up. In the old days that would spur someone on into setting up a business to cater for that part of the market, but a lot less likely now.
We had a well known, and long established, Yamaha dealer, Road and Track close it's doors a couple or so year's ago, but a USP of the business was it's spares and accessory sideline. It was effectively the only place on the island you could go and buy one screw, or 6" of fuel pipe, or a couple of stick on race numbers etc etc. When the doors shut of the main shop there was still a stock of bits left, so one of the former owners set-up a 'temporary' pop-up shop with the intention to clear the rest of the bits in a few months. It's still going (albeit on limited hours) with new stock, as the demand for the service didn't go away.

 

[CLEMTOG]

well I was brught up during the Pride & Clarke era, when more than half of Stockwell road, Brixton was their red painted shops, I tried to PX an 18 month old SF1 with them and they had never heard of them, running to find information from books, around the corner from them was Gus Khun motors , Norton as ever and (at the time) MV, which is where the PX was going, they claimed the 750 was good for 160MPH (yeah right oh!) a little further away was two shops on Brixton Hill called George clarke Motors, they had old British bikes on a high level shelf around the outside edges of the shops, the for sale ones on the floor, which at one time including Hal kendalls 750 American Eagle, (later badged Laverda) chassis no 1222. Heading SE (for home) was "Myers motors" at Sydenham, just about the best motorcycle breaker that I ever encountered, then their was Hockliss m/c and Boyers of Bromley, Cray motorcycles in Orpington, not forgetting local dealer, Sevenaoks motorcycles, whose manager was Roger (Wobbly) Warburton, who drove his car there and back every day and it was all of 600 yards, I know from "inside sources" that he is no longer in that house and was last seen by me in a wheelchair sufferring diabetis, Lost touch and know no more of him.
CLEM

 

[Paul Marx]

Two of my sons have 748 Ducatis.
Modern bikes to me.
The local Ducati dealership won't touch them. Too old.
I think that I'm getting too old as well.

Paul

 

[Exmoor beast]

It certainly could become an issue for more owners of bikes that are maybe only 10-20 years old and the manufacturers/sales companies not providing a spares and service back-up. In the old days that would spur someone on into setting up a business to cater for that part of the market, but a lot less likely now.
We had a well known, and long established, Yamaha dealer, Road and Track close it's doors a couple or so year's ago, but a USP of the business was it's spares and accessory sideline. It was effectively the only place on the island you could go and buy one screw, or 6" of fuel pipe, or a couple of stick on race numbers etc etc. When the doors shut of the main shop there was still a stock of bits left, so one of the former owners set-up a 'temporary' pop-up shop with the intention to clear the rest of the bits in a few months. It's still going (albeit on limited hours) with new stock, as the demand for the service didn't go away.

Glad to hear it! I think the future of spares will be one man band/ working from home- a hobby business. Of course whilst we can blame EBay etc for the demise of the traditional bike shop it may well be the saviour as it can provide a worldwide platform for selling obsolete old crap.
Get out the green blanket and stack it high!

 

[Exmoor beast]

Two of my sons have 748 Ducatis.
Modern bikes to me.
The local Ducati dealership won't touch them. Too old.
I think that I'm getting too old as well.

Paul

I’ve mentioned before this “ it’s to old for us to touch .. “ bit rough if you were having your backside licked by the same salesman ten years before! BMW told me we shouldn’t be working on “Old bones” referring to the K series- so much for flagship models.
Lady I know had a Land Rover with automatic handbrake that decided to stay permanently on, requiring it to be unceremoniously dragged onto a flatbed recovery truck. She was told “ being three years old you should really be thinking of changing it!”

 

[rocketonarail]

The Chinese will change all that.
Paul

Someone in one of the bike magazines reckoned recently that with the Chinese you simply get what you pay for ......... if you want stuff supplied at minimal cost then they will happily do that , just don`t expect it to be top quality .......

If however , you want something supplied that meets the highest standards , then they will happily do that as well ....... you just have to pay the higher price for it ........

The thing is , In the past , manufacturers have looked to China as a way of manufacturing high volume items at the lowest ( most profitable ) unit cost ....... hence the poor quality image ..........

The Chinese themselves have been just as guilty ..... churn out high volume cheaply made products to satisfy the huge home market , and flood overseas markets with these items too .......... undercutting and eventually driving all the better quality stuff ..... ( mechanical , electrical , whatever ) ....off the shelves , purely on cost alone ........

But as soon as the Japanese started to base motorcycle production in China , then the quality of those particular Chinese made products was immediately elevated ......... See if you can tell the difference between a Chinese made , or Japanese made Suzuki .......... there is no difference ............

When you see the Suzuki or Yamaha name on the bike`s tank , then you expect a quality product ..... whether it was made in China or not .......

The Chinese will happily build bikes to Japanese standards , but you pay Japanese prices , not Chinese prices , for them .

And as the Chinese start to buy up redundant European brands ...........( Moto Morini , Benelli , and so on ) ....... then there will be a marketing requirement ... ( brand name , image , targeted buyers etc. ) ....... to ensure those products meet a better quality standard , with an increased product purchase price to cover the costs all this involves ........

........ All the Chinese have really been waiting for is an established name ... ( the afore-mentioned Morini , Benelli and so on ) ..... to use as a world wide marketing tool , to stick on gradually improving products , which they can then sell on with an gradually increasing price tag ..........


John Bloor used the same tactic when he bought the Triumph name to stick on the tanks of his bikes ......

A Bloor 900 ? ....... what the hell is that ? ....... Now then , a Triumph 900 ......... that`s much more like it ....... ................


Which reminds me ....... Wasn`t the original intention of the Japanese Shengen Group ... ( or whatever they were called ) .... in buying the Moto Laverda business was so that they could use the " Laverda " logo on things like handbags , wristwatches , men`s underwear , and so on ... ? .........

Not sure if the Laverda name was that well known to prompt someone in Japan to buy a handbag with that name stamped on it ......... but I suppose it might have sounded vaguely European enough to tempt some .......

 

[pf1]

So what is the point of a Chinese Suzuki if it costs the same as a Japanese Suzuki? That is their only advantage gone.

 

[The Sock]

So what is the point of a Chinese Suzuki if it costs the same as a Japanese Suzuki? That is their only advantage gone.

Because it costs the same to you, but not necessarily as much, to Suzuki, as one built in Japan.
That’s the advantage from Suzuki’s point of view.

 

[rocketonarail]

So what is the point of a Chinese Suzuki if it costs the same as a Japanese Suzuki? That is their only advantage gone.

Dunno , but there must be a reason.......... I guess there must be manufacturing price advantage ( cheaper labour costs almost certainly ) , as opposed to it`s eventual retail price once it`s got the Suzuki badge on it`s tank .

The Suzuki model is probably built alongside , and for pretty much the same cost , as it`s Chinese Ying Pong Poo equivalent ........ but having the Japanese name on the tank means it can be sold on at a premium once it finds it`s way outside of China ........ Shipping costs worldwide probably don`t differ much between China and Japan .

There is also the huge Chinese home market for bikes ...... so grabbing a piece of that action must be worthwhile , for relatively little effort ........ the Chinese manufacturing infrastructure ...... factories , workforce , plus dealership network ....... is already up and running ..........

 

[pf1]

Perhaps but made China still means shite to me and judging by things I've bought recently they may look the bees knees and have European names but they are still below par. The last thing to see the bin was a supposedly Spanish milk frother that looked great wasn't cheap and failed within a few months. Made in good old China.

 

[rocketonarail]

A few years ago I bought a Lexmoto Street 125 .....( Lexmoto are based in Exeter and import Chinese bikes , the Ying Poos mentioned earlier , and stick the Lexmoto badge on them ) .

The Street 125 / Ying Poo was based on the Suzuki GS125 , and this one had about 400 miles on the clock when I bought it .

I wasn`t expecting too much , as this came off the line as a Chinese Ying Poo , not a Chinese Suzuki ........ but the real GS125 is a nice little bike , so I reckoned i this would make a decent second , runabout type of bike , even if it did happen to be a little rough around the edges .......

It cost me about eight hundred quid from a dealer in Worcester , and I had it delivered down to Bristol ...... ok , I was doing things the easy ( lazy ) way , but for less than a grand , it was worth the risk , wasn`t it ?

..... It was absolutely bloody awful ...... asthmatic ..... slow ...... uncomfortable , with razor sharp side panels sticking into your thighs ........ and it steered with all the precision of a shopping trolley ..........

Whatever the current situation regarding Chinese built bikes today , they have to be an improvement on that .......


BTW ........... When the Japanese ( or anyone ) look to have production shifted abroad , whether it be Brazil , USA , Spain , Thailand ....... to take advantage of producing specific models for the local market , or cheaper labour costs , or cutting shipping costs ...... then in most cases , that will require new factories to be built , a new workforce to be hired , dealer and export networks to be set up .........

The advantage with China .... ( and to some extent India ) ....... is that all this stuff is already in place , just waiting to be plugged into .....

 

[Paul Marx]

When I was a kid, made in Hong Kong meant cheap, simple, mass produced, short lived.
Well, Hong Kong has won the game and old nostalgics of a time that never existed haven't understood yet.
One can only learn from one's mistakes.

The page has turned.

Paul

 

[rocketonarail]

Apparently , in one of the Japanese bike factories ( not sure which ) , there used to be , maybe still is , a sign on the factory wall which reads , in English ........ " Made In Japan ....... Nobody laughs now " ........ ..........

 

[rocketonarail]

Getting back to disappeared dealers .......... There used to be in my neck of the woods a spares dealer called Bristol Spares And Accessories .........

Despite it`s name , it was actually based just south of Bath , at Limpley Stoke .

In the late seventies I used to go there for bits and pieces for the Trident ...... It was located opposite a pub down a lane .... there was a gate to a field which you passed through , riding along the edge of the field , with the Bristol to London railway line just to your right , until you crested a rise and a small parking area came into view .

You would then walk across a wooden bridge above the River Avon , to a large wooden warehouse which stood on the opposite side of the river , which was BS&A .......

There was no indication from the road that it existed ....... it was hidden from view , with just an unmarked open gate leading into that field ........

Even now I can`t remember how I knew it was there .......

 

[oldiggy]

I might be looking through rose tinted glasses but there was something quite magical looking around at the British bikes in those dark dingy premises as a seventeen year old, the smell of oil and petrol, smelt like freedom. By the time of when I bought my new gsxr 750 in 1986 at comerfords Surrey the dealers were all bright and clean antiseptic looking which was no bad thing but it seems to have gone too far that way. When I go past HGB and Daytona there are rows of soulless looking bikes and no 17 yr olds looking at them or anyone in fact. I thought my mirage was fuggly but some of those new bikes are hideous the silencers wouldn’t look out of place on a Saturn rocket ( says me who had a rocket 3 silencer on my starfire) I’m not sure what the answer is to get teens on bikes apart from the hundreds of delivery riders on scooters that go past my house. Motor cycle city was another big name probably gone.

 

[Tippie]

I might be looking through rose tinted glasses but there was something quite magical looking around at the British bikes in those dark dingy premises as a seventeen year old, the smell of oil and petrol, smelt like freedom. I’m not sure what the answer is to get teens on bikes apart from the hundreds of delivery riders on scooters that go past my house. Motor cycle city was another big name probably gone.

There are hordes of school age teens here on the new transformers looking 125 bikes from many manufacturers, all with the loudest Akra pot on them. Generally throwing away a lot of the safety they learned at the extremely thorough learning and licensing process here in Norway, following way too close to cars generally, but also not dressed for meeting the asphalt. A small percentage will keep on bikes but most go to cars, mainly because of the climate.
If we cave to the EU demands of TUV/MOT for bikes here it will be very difficult with so few bike workshops so widely spread throughout this long skinny country, and many owners with a few bikes. So far the fact that roadworthiness has been a virtually non-existent factor in mc related accidents the rider organisation has managed to keep it out.

 

[Andy J]

Spotty teenagers on little bikes with the loudest exhaust possible isn’t just the fashion in Norway. Plenty of them about in the IOM too! Difference is, some of them go onto being MGP/TT winners over here.
(The downside, quite a few also end up dead before they’re 25.)