Barely bike related

Fitz

Fitz

Senior member
Location
Cheshire UK
I dont suppose we have a VW diesel specialist amongst our brethren

My race van (T5 2.5TDI 5 cylinder job) was getting very hard to start and starting to smoke a little

Having had some work done on an injector previously I knew the cam had seen better days

After the poor starting problem, the guys that look after all of my cars and van told me that it was likely to be seals / o-rings on the injectors causing the starting problem. While it was apart we decided to change the cam and buckets

It started immediately, all went well until the test drive, they got about 2 miles and it stopped, it had performed perfectly but had to be recovered

Since then, the van will not start. They have checked transfer fuel pump, high pressure fuel pump (7bar available) the cam timing was done using the correct special tool, its just as though the injectors wont work, for no apparent reason. It will run if you squirt stuff down the inlet, it just wont put fuel through the injectors

These guys are no mugs, they work on very high end cars normally, Bentleys, Range Rover, Maserati, BMW, Audi etc very highly qualified but they are completely stumped

I need my van back in service and am desperate for ideas from somebody with real knowledge, I tried VW UK and they very nice but did not provide any help other than to suggest taking it to one of their van centres

HELP
 
My T4 van is 2.5TDI but is 4 cylinder. I recently had to fit a new injector pump belt and set the injector timing. How different is the 5 cylinder motor? the only 2.5TDI I know of is 4 cyl.
 
Hi

Do a Net search, there is a common fault with T5's.

Can't remember the detail but its a design fault that kills the catalyst & DPF.

If it is this, it can be terminal. sorry for scaring you.

A friend of mine had this issue and after much haggling with VW they supplied a replacement motor at a good price.

  Good Luck
            Matt

 
Fitz,

Does your TDI have unit injectors or common rail?  I understand T5s can be either.

Might be an idea to replace the electrical loom to the injectors.  My 1.9TDI with unit injectors starting deteriorated to the point it was 50/50 and initial idle was erratic.  A new loom cured the symptom completely.  Checking the old loom showed no obvious defects. 

Crank and cam position sensors seem to be critical on many VAG TDIs as well.  Got both lined up for replacement... 430000km and counting!

piet
 
Might be a slight chance that is has something to do with the eletrickery as Piet mentioned, but then usually (not always) showing up in the error log. IMHO you're in for a cylinder head or engine overhaul, sorry for the bad news. That it starts on the ether spray says nothing, any worn out diesel engine will do so. Personally, I wouldn't touch anything past the T4 with a barge pole.
 
Gravelroad said:
Might be a slight chance that is has something to do with the eletrickery as Piet mentioned, but then usually (not always) showing up in the error log. IMHO you're in for a cylinder head or engine overhaul, sorry for the bad news. That it starts on the ether spray says nothing, any worn out diesel engine will do so. Personally, I wouldn't touch anything past the T4 with a barge pole.
Click to expand...

And T4s proved to be a barely manageable can of worms. ::)

Quite a few of these problems don't show on error logs, I found that out the hard way!

piet
 
Bloody weird issue. You'd have to suspect either pump, injectors or CPU surely (which includes wiring to same) - either the CPU isn't telling the pump and injectors to send fuel, or it is but the injectors/pump are refusing to listen. I thought this was what plug-in diagnostic units were supposed to do for our VAG cars? 

And a motor doesn't run perfectly then wear out during a test drive, so I totally disagree about the need for a new head.

Mine's a 2.0TDI but PD (not common rail) - had the harness to the injectors replaced as oil was contaminating the fuel system.
 
Hi Piranha, on these engines it is actually a bit different wear than we are used too (valves, cylinders). The injectors are wearing out their seats in the head, and it might take only 2 miles and the new seals are toast again.
Some specialists here in Germany have developed a workaround by using some kind of wedges + some machining on the injectors to solve the issue. Fitz, you might show this website to the guys working on your T5: https://www.pdekeile.com/pdekeilebeschreibung. It's in German, so you might send it through the Goggle translator first, together with the pictures on the site it should somehow make it clear to them how it works. It might not be back to perfect, but should work for some time, supposing no cracks are present. Probably a good idea to follow Piets advice and replace the loom as well.

Piet: I used  to drive a T4 (2.5 TDI long version) from 1993 on in the company I was working back then. I had clocked 500.000 on it when I left the company and it was still running perfectly well. It never let me down and needed only the usual wear parts to be replaced now and then within the regular inspections. Excellent car, and I think it surely helped that it was equipped with zero extras apart from power windows in the front doors and a fuel heater. ::)
 
Stefan,

During the time I ran my auto parts and accesories shop, I visited a lot of independant auto workshops.  T4s were always at the forefront when it came to tales of woe, complicated and not really built to be able to be repaired!  Lots of improvising required if special tools weren't to hand.  T4 and its successors will never become one of my favourites...

piet
 
Piet, I never touched it myself, and probably missed out all the swearing of the mechanics at the VAG center when they serviced it. I didn't had to pay the bills either. :D Personally I have never owned a car in my life so far, and will not do so in the future, and I really hate driving them, I always feel trapped, these tinboxes are IMHO just a waste of money and time. For heavy haulage like bringing in a few cases of beer to the garden party I have my sturdy old Vespa 150GS, and for going on long distance holiday trips the Laverda triple is my favorite, but most of the daily routine is done by bicycle. There hasn't been barely a day since age of 4 without cycling, and I still enjoy it every day. Cars suck.
 
Thanks for the explanation, Gravel. Makes more sense. I'm with you on the bicycle! (but the Skoda Scout does get used more city use than it should in our family)
 
sfcpiet said:
And T4s proved to be a barely manageable can of worms. ::)
piet
Click to expand...

Contradiction!

The T4-motors and the T5 2.5 5-cylinder where extremely stable engines that where designed for 500.000 km!

I have driven several VW California cars and sold 375,000 km each. With the first engine and first clutch and no measurable oil consumption !!!

In the meantime I drive the 5th Californa, a T5 2.0 Biturbo with 180 hp. Designed only for 300.000 km.

Catastrophe!
From 90,000 km he drank petrol and oil like a sailor. From 85% engine power, it overheated and built up overpressure until the cooling water ran out.
In addition, the two-mass weight was already knocked out and the right drive shaft (next to turbo, fat evaporated) was knocked out.

After a year of dispute with VW, I looked for the cause myself (incorrect design of the EGR cooler, construction errors) and gave VW the choice of replacing the (CFCA) engine or I will publish my findings on the Internet.

Then I got a completely new engine with a more modern head and a better designed EGR cooler (version "D").
Since then everything is ok again.

Meanwhile VW admits that more than 10% of these engines have already been replaced (see youtube "redhead + T5").

If we can travel again in 1-2 years, I will replace the T5 with a Toyota HZJ78 (Bush Taxi) that is designed for 1,000,000 km. No Electronic, no Ad Blue.

Thomas aus LAU
 
Gravelroad said:
Piet, I never touched it myself, and probably missed out all the swearing of the mechanics at the VAG center when they serviced it. I didn't had to pay the bills either. :D Personally I have never owned a car in my life so far, and will not do so in the future, and I really hate driving them, I always feel trapped, these tinboxes are IMHO just a waste of money and time. For heavy haulage like bringing in a few cases of beer to the garden party I have my sturdy old Vespa 150GS, and for going on long distance holiday trips the Laverda triple is my favorite, but most of the daily routine is done by bicycle. There hasn't been barely a day since age of 4 without cycling, and I still enjoy it every day. Cars suck.
Click to expand...

Dunno how you're going to haul 3 tons of timber for a new roof on your bike, Stefan!

I'm quite dependant on my car/s, if only for hauling heavy or bulky loads.  Located out in the sticks, the nearest shop for anything is a good 6km away.  I really do not fancy hopping on a bicycle for every errand, the weekly shopping alone fills up the Skoda trunk nicely.  Re-building an old half-timbered farm house and barns by myself doesn't lend itself well to bicycles or motorcycles only either.

The daily 50km each way to OCT would simply be a pita on a bicycle.  Crossing through Bonn on a sunny morning is a nightmare on a motorcycle, let alone on a bicycle in adverse conditions.  Bicycles are certainly NOT the general answer to traffic congestion.  I need close to 1 hour with the car or motorcycle going around/through Bonn on the autobahn, cycling would take about twice that.  Commuting by bus and train would take almost 3 hours each way.  A day is too short for that sort of bullshit...

piet
 

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chrisk said:
A race van? Good god, there?s a racing class for everything these days.
Click to expand...
I bought a VW 'Race Van' earlier this year. It then also hardly ever started or went anywhere for 6 months. Effing covid-19.....  :(
 
Cool looking buildings, Piet. Traffic in Melbourne has become bad enough that I can beat it by bicycle even on a 15-30km run. Mind you, that's riding a lot quicker than someone might on a sit-up-and-beg commuter. Still absolutely need a car - big shopping, towing the camper trailer, family outings ...
 
My "race van" T4 Transporter has been used by every family member, relative, mate, etc far more than any chance it gets to park in the depot.
Too bloody useful.
 
I had a Holden Ute for my first car for 15 years, I must have moved house for every person I ever met back then.
 
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