Irish Roads Season is go

enjoy the event Bob. I did have the event in my sights earlier in the year but with the insurance issue and then family issues I had to give it a miss. Hopefully, I’ll manage to get there next year.
 
Great practice day both modern and classics good fast racing with importantly no incidents.
All the boys and not forgetting Yvonne Montgomery were riding fast and smooth.
I just love how close you are to the action at roads circuits.
Me and my son watch from the garden of the mint coloured bungalow just up from
Black jump.
All things being equal will be there again next year with my son.
Good place to view and the family plow takings from food and parking into the McMillan Cancer charity so a very good cause.
Bob
 
It is interesting that the team ran the carbon wheels in 2019 and 2022. They are OEM on the homologation version of the bike, not an aftermarket item. Indeed the rules expressly ban aftermarket wheels as well as carbon wheels. Truly a Catch-22 situation!
 
That's just completely stupid and typical of Sporting Regulators everywhere, a 2-year president where those wheels were ok and then ban a couple of your top draw cards at the last minute after all that Insurance Drama. It's like they actively want to destroy their own Golden Goose.
 
Crazy. But also, what competent team would base their campaign around a bike which is not eligible? If there are no carbon, nor aftermarket wheels allowed, then you don't choose a model with carbon wheels fitted originally. I know nothing of modern BMW S1000's but presumably the only one with carbon wheels is the absolute super duper version, hence with the highest performance. Sounds to me that the team deliberately chose the variant to get a slight performance advantage, playing brinksmanship and assuming they would not get protested due to their high profile. The article says another bloke on a BMW won, so there are obviously variants of the bike that do meet the eligibility requirements.

Sounds annoying, and disappointing for the team and the race fans, but ultimately it's the team's error surely?

Hope the rest of the event is a good success after all the drama. I've been to one roadrace in Ireland, it was awesome.
 
breganzane said:
Crazy. But also, what competent team would base their campaign around a bike which is not eligible?
Click to expand...

The whole point of the ridiculousness is the bikes were legal until about 5 minutes before the race started. They were legal in preceding years and another team was using aluminum wheels on their BMW which should have been illegal as they were not the homologated wheels.
Much fuckery involved in this type of decision ...... very sad.

Jim
 
From afar and without knowing all the details, it certainly sounds like cynical gamesmanship.
Although I’ve also seen several times in various sports and clubs where a power shift among the organisers ends up upsetting what seems like the most stable of competitions. Knowing what’s been argued in the backrooms for the last couple of years could be interesting.
 
The question is why did the organizers decide to allow the BMW 1000RR to race in 2019 and 2022? They must have know that the RR version did not meet the class requirements and yet they allowed them to race both years. Was it a protest this year that got them to enforce their own rulebook?
 
Here's the result of five miniutes on google... no idea whether there are specifics involved which do not show up here.

The supp regs are here:
Under Superstock it says the following:
10. Wheels:
● Wheels must remain as originally produced by the manufacturer at the time of
sale into the dealer/distributor network for the homologated machine.
● No Carbon fibre composite wheels are allowed, only aluminum alloys wheels
are permitted to be used.
● The speedometer drive may be removed and replaced with a spacer.
● If the original design included a cushion drive for the rear wheel, it must remain as
originally produced for the homologated Machine.
● No modifications of the wheel-axles or any fixing and mounting points for front and
rear brake caliper are authorised.
● Spacers can be modified. Modifications to keep spacers in place are permitted.
● Wheel diameter and rim width must remain as originally homologated.

On the BMW page here:
www.bmwmotorcycles.com

S 1000 RR

The S 1000 RR has now been made even sharper and more precisely geared towards pure performance on race tracks or country roads. For everyone demanding the maximum from themselves and their bike.
www.bmwmotorcycles.com www.bmwmotorcycles.com
It says:
"The M package sharpens the sporty profile of the RR. Exclusive Light White/M Motorsport paint is only included in this package and gives the motorcycle a powerful look. The package includes: M Sport seat for optimum support on the hunt for crucial milliseconds. Weight-optimized M Carbon wheels with M graphics for maximum riding dynamics. Or the alternatively available M forged wheels. In addition, the M footrest system and the black fuel filler cap."

So from that incredibly brief check it would appear that the team used the optional carbon wheels even though they are specifically disallowed and there is an approved OE aluminium wheel for the model. Pretty black and white, not sure what their beef is?

If it's as a result of a protest by a competitor, that may well be because they are annoyed at the advantage gained by the other, or feel that they might gain an advantage by the protest, but also it could be genuine concern that they should not have their rider racing in a pack at 300kmh with bikes which are shod with wheels which have been specifically disallowed because of a perceived risk of catastrophic failure without warning. Why the organisers have been letting them run like that is indeed the question. It would be interesting to hear from anyone over there closer to the facts than us.
 
I hate it when someone makes sense of apparently stupid stuff, how can I rant if you point out facts? Wheres the fun in facts?
 
I’m sure all of us who have raced have been involved at some time in discussions regarding deviations from the published regulations and whether anyone has gained an advantage or been disadvantaged. Some were minor deviations, like missing chain guards, others more significant such as engine or tank capacity and they haven’t always resulted in a consistent ruling, which can be irritating.
Deliberate cheating to gain an advantage should always be clamped down on if discovered as should any perceived safety violation. It’s always open to someone to argue, based on evidence of course, for a change to the rules, but until they are changed they should abide by the extant rules or go and start their own racing club.
I have no idea why the wheels were allowed previously, but just because they got away with it in the past doesn’t mean they have a right to go on getting away with it.
 
helicopterjim said:
You'd think that the Tech Inspectors would have noticed ...... so why did they wait until 5 minutes before the race to inform them?

Jim
Click to expand...
Been in similar positions. You're only checking safety items against a checklist. Similar to preflight checklists. With a lot of bikes to get through in a limited time you're eyes only on what has to be checked. One set of black wheels looks very like another and it is the bike owner/teams responsibility to ensure it fits the homologation documents.
It possibly comes down to asking - is this a 2021 or 22 or 23 model and checking against the docs for that year/model. Which should be done when the entry is received - not at safety check time.

Scrutineering the Britten you always had a queasy feeling about the homemade carbon wheels. I wouldn't have let them run them on roads circuits.

The whole thing reminds me of a snippet from a TT report in Motor Cycling back in the day.
An Irish rider at scrutineering presented his production class Yamaha 250 with wire wheels and aluminium rims fitted.
The scrutineer asked "Are those optional then?"
The Irishman replied " Oh no sorr, you can have either "
 
Okay, so there's an S1000RR as I linked above, and these days there is also an M1000RR which is the superest duperest version of it and has standard carbon wheels, apparently no aluminium option. But don't choose a bike that doesn't comply with the regs right?

There's probably a whole different discussion regarding whether the ban on carbon wheels is valid anymore. My hazy recollection is that Robert Dunlop was nearly killed when a carbon wheel collapsed on an RS250 at the IoM and flung him into a cottage. Carbon wheels were hence banned from roads racing, I think all forms of racing actually. They are specifically banned in MotoGP at least, wheels there must be aluminium or Magnesium alloy. It seems a bit silly of BMW to sell a "race version" of a model where the only wheel option is not legal in most (all?) race classes. Just for pose value down at the cafe then. :)

But time and technology moves on, you'd think if a giant like BMW has done the testing and felt comfortable enough to fit a road registerable bike with them, then they're probably going to be OK. I think the sketchy thing is always regarding crash or other impact/fatigue damage, an aluminium wheel will bend and crack and damage can be detected, while damage to a carbon component can remain hidden until the moment of total failure and/or the failure mode is more unpredictable. Always brings to mind the One Australia 12m yacht going down, crack, snap, glug glug glug. :D
 
Not the first time BMW have had probs with the regs. At the TT cylinder heads get lifted for post race measurement. M Sport who supply the race engines to BMW teams will fine you if you take the head off one of their engines. Win or place and it costs you.
 
The GM Corvette has carbon fiber wheels as an option as do other super cars. Obviously they don’t find them to be a danger, not to the buyer, the warranty or to the bottom
 
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