Laverda Jota vs BMW R90S. Ownership?

I own a very nicely restored Orange R90S and have to agree with some of the comments here, a very different proposition to my Laverda. We did a comparison with my Commando and the Beemer on a Lemon Drizzle Gang video (see link) as they are actually quite close in terms of performance, whereas the Laverda is a fair bit quicker.
The beemer is quite fussy about tyre pressures but rewards a smooth riding style, and the brakes (even with a handlebar mounted master cylinder conversion) are a fair way behind brembos of the period. However, if I wanted a spirited ride to, say, the South of France, then I'd take that R90S tomorrow without a moments thought.
After an afternoon on the 3CL I need a lay down on the sofa!


 
My Motorcycle Buddy bought a 71 750 BMW R90S shaft drive where as I bought a 70 Breganzie 750 SF. Needless to say that BMW 750 was the BEST 2 Up moped Racer I've ever saddled as a Passenger - My other Motorcycling Buddy had a 1971 Ducati 750 SS.

I talking Northern Ontario Canada despite the Honda and Kawasaki craze - Suzuki did not come on until later ;o)

Needless to say I would be conformable of carrying my Wife or Kids on the Passengers Seat of a BMW R90S.

Even though the shifts go CLUNK - But SOLID - Doubt you could ware out that ride FAST enough !

Face It: NO Triumph, Norton or BMW nor Jap Bike could come close to Breganzie 750 Twin back then: Perhaps a Ducati 750 SS, if she was tuned. Not even MV Augusta, nor the Honda CBX 750 4 could beat the Breganzie 750 Twin in her day.

Breganzie Triples came later and ruled to 1984 until the Suzuki 1100 GWX appeared ;o(

The Breganzie 750 Twin: Short Wheel Base, Top heavy, rather heavy with approx 75 Hp and do near 8000 rpm and stay planted with descent tires and tuned suspension with lot of muscle power and practice to throw her over in Cafe Style - Not a Bike for us Old Men to handle if your thinking of a Fast Ride - Great Bike for a Strong Young Cafe Enthusiasts - She will teach you to over come all your fears about racing - May God Protect You - LOL

PS: Never saddled a 3cl Breganzie Jota but I did a 84 Suzuki 1100 GWX Kantana and I must say cruising at 140 mph was TOO much for me ;o)

I would sooner race at under 125mph in the straights in Cambrian shield.

Right now at 76 I'd be lucky to ride a Bicycle.
 
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Such completely different animals. I love my RGS, and I love airheads. My '73 R75/5 is my favorite around town scoot, and it's fabulous on gravel roads, which are plentiful around here and supply miles of enjoyable adventure.
 
Ron, your 750SF had approximately 75HP? A factory condition 750SFC does not even have 75HP.

Unless modified, there is no way it had that much HP. A good running 750SF has at best 60HP. I have a 1973 Norton commando and it is most definitely faster than a 750SF. Also a number of Japanese bike of the era handled very poorly but made lots more power than a Laverda 750.
 
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R 90S built 2 years before the factory started production.....
Maybe we need a subboard " tell a fib" to keep the BS out of this forum
:rolleyes:
 
1200ts: I rode a Norton 750 Commando - Very popular ride around Sudbury Ontario back in the late 60's and early 70's before the killer Kawasaki 2 Stroke and 900's appeared. There's no way a Norton Commando 750 or an Interstate 850 can out run a Laverda 750 SF.

I may have exaggerated the Hp but shifting at 7500 rpm with a Breganzie says it all.

Man them late 60's and early 70's 750's 4 Stroke Twins (Triumph, BSA, Norton, Laverda, Guzzi Lemans, Ducati ... etc) and you are 22 years old was Great Time in the Big Twin era.

As I say; I never saddled a Breganzie Triple but would have gladly swapped my 10.000rpm 4cyl Suzuki GSX 1100 Kantana for your 1200ts in the early 80's ;o)

PS:
One thing about the Breganzie 750 SF if you intend to race her year after year is to get rid of them heavy Cast Iron Valves because they tend to pound the valve seats for something like Manley Stainless Ultra light weights and insert smaller Dia Silicon Bronze Guides along with a rather stiff Valve spring and do a Performance Valve Seat grind plus some porting to approach 8000rpm. I think the cast pistons are good enough for that RPM range. Change Oil twice or at least once every season, 20w50 Truckers Diesel. Early Breganzie 750S and SF's did not come with an Air filter on Amal or Delortor Carbs = Racing.

Change Valve springs every 2 years.

Now you have a True Racing Engine - Breganzie designed the carcass to do what ever you want to do with her ;o)

WARNING: You have to have the timing a fuel mix Right ON or you risk HOLING a PISTON say within 3 miles particularity if you lug her in 5th gear. Don't ask how I know. Just saying run your Main Jets RICH to be safe.

1200ts: Just guessing maybe that's where I got my 75 Hp from and note them light Weight Slater Bro 2 into 1 Pipes.

I will defend the Breganzie 750 SF until the day I die - That's why I'm on this Forum ;o)

In Regards to the Title: "Laverda Jota vs BMW R90S. Ownership?" I would have to pick the BMW R90S mainly because I never saddled a Breganzie 3cyl ;o)

All I can say about my beloved 70 Breganzie 750 SFO was that she was a Life and Death Experience which lasted for 45 years and lasted longer then my marriage plus I got more money in return by selling that Breganzie than my My X ever allotted me - By than I'm too OLD to Care - HIC!

My A Wife died a few years ago of COPD at 64. Terrible disease, but now I'm FREE of her Wrath and Breganzies - Waiting for the LAST HIC at 76 in a CHEAP Seniors Home on a 2nd floor Villa on the North Shore of Lake Huron. Still have my Jeep, Trailer and Canoe providing I have the cause to continue. I do suffer ach and pains of broken bones from my past but just keep getting fat, lazy and sipping scotch.
 
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"There's no way a Norton Commando 750 or an Interstate 850 can out run a Laverda 750 SF."

I have no dog in this fight, but clearly one of the main advantages of the commando (in acceleration anyway) is lower weight, about 40-50 lbs in kickstart form. Once Norton added an electric start (of sorts) it got much closer.

The dyno chart below shows around a 2bhp top end advantage over an American Eagle, probably much closer in later big valve/bigger carb Laverda form?

These days it's more a case of which is the least slow rather than anything else!


dyno_early superbikes.jpg
 
I will throw my opinion in on the SF(1) v Norton commando (750) and even triumph bonneville (650 t120) as I own one of each. The commando (1968) feels a little sharper low down but no way is it faster than the sf1. The Bonnie feels as light as a pushbike in this company (with the SF1 feeling by far the heaviest of the three. Once up to speed there is only one winner and it isn’t British. As much as I love all three the Laverda is a far superior motorbike in terms of quality and I would jump on it to go anywhere without worrying whether it would get me there and back. My Bonnie is surprisingly reliable (although I regularly have to tighten things up) and doesn’t leak oil. My commando is lovely to ride but I have still not ironed out the little niggles - and I will back in the garage to fix a few things again on Monday 😂.
 
wavey_davey said:
"There's no way a Norton Commando 750 or an Interstate 850 can out run a Laverda 750 SF."

I have no dog in this fight, but clearly one of the main advantages of the commando (in acceleration anyway) is lower weight, about 40-50 lbs in kickstart form. Once Norton added an electric start (of sorts) it got much closer.

The dyno chart below shows around a 2bhp top end advantage over an American Eagle, probably much closer in later big valve/bigger carb Laverda form?

These days it's more a case of which is the least slow rather than anything else!


View attachment 89345
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Interesting looking at the power graphs, having been out on my sf1 with my friend on his triumph t150 trident the two feel totally different. When I first rode the triumph I could not believe how much faster it felt than the laverda, it really feels rapid whereas the laverda seems to gradually build speed. Ridden side by side on flat out acceleration the difference was not so great, whichever one of us rode whichever bike the triumph pulled out a yard early on and that is how it stayed, just a yard ahead, not much in it at all. Talk about deceiving. He also has a BSA spitfire mk1 which goes like stink. I run a guzzi lemans 1 too which is one fast, impressive long distance bike.
 
Haggis said:
I've owned an R90S and current run a '79 R100RT.

IMHO BMW airheads are' quirky' and an acquired taste, therfore not immediately comparable to any 3C (or any normal bike). I heartily recommend you ride the R90S for at least half a day to 'learn' how to ride it. The first few miles are likely to feel horrible.

If I wanted to ride for 9 hours, I'd choose the RT, purely for the comfort. But my 3C out-does it in every dynamic measure.

I don't like the lack of adjustability on the BMW (levers, etc)

Warm feet nice in winter, not so nice in summer.

Summary, they are very different and so it's all a matter of taste.
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Rearsets on my 90/S keep boots from toasting. Gearbox not bad with practice. Having said that, I've barely ridden it since 3C came along.
 
Basically they are all Wonderful BIG Twins from the late 60's and early 70's from Europe - Great time to be Motorcyclists Enthusiast when I was young ;o)

Jap Bikes may have been faster but were handling KILLERS ;o(
 
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Chrisk: NO a 3rd to 2nd 7500rpm down shift at 60 Mph resulting in a wheelie going down hill with a tale wind with some clutch slippage ;o)

It actually happened while passing Ford Rancharo Station Wagon full of Kids. You should have seen the smile of them Kids as I desperately held on the bars with the front wheel off the ground.

Really MY 70 Breganzie 750 SF0 was and unexpected Big Twin Rocket at Times.
 
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Laverda SF said:
Chrisk: NO a 3rd to 2nd 7500rpm down shift at 60 Mph resulting in a wheelie going down hill with a tale wind with some clutch slippage ;o)

It actually happened while passing Ford Rancharo Station Wagon full of Kids. You should have seen the smile of them Kids as I desperately held on the bars with the front wheel off the ground.

Really MY 70 Breganzie 750 SF0 was and unexpected Big Twin Rocket at Times.
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Bugger, that really fucks up a legendary story. Can’t we just stick to my version?
 
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