RGS1000SFC Clutch Inspection

hi rockitdoc, for what its worth I think your doing OK, the thing is every day is a school day and for those of us that have rebuilt laverda engines it gets the heart pounding when you first hit the button. in fact its the best feeling when she cracks in to life. so you carry on and take no notice of the doubters < at the end of the day its your bike and your time. my next project is a sfc1000 engine that lost its oil pump drive due to a so call experts engine rebuild.
good look and safe riding Andy
 
Hi Scott

Did you undo the nut on the top of the crankcase? There are about 22 nuts on the bottom but only one on top. It's hiding under the starter motor.

If you're certain that all nuts are off. The case should come apart. Be patient and gentle with it. The gorilla snot may glue the halves together, but it's not a strong bond. Just go around gently tapping with a soft faced hammer until the joint cracks open. Don't wallop it too hard or drive wedges in.
 
laverdas said:
hi rockitdoc, for what its worth I think your doing OK, the thing is every day is a school day and for those of us that have rebuilt laverda engines it gets the heart pounding when you first hit the button. in fact its the best feeling when she cracks in to life. so you carry on and take no notice of the doubters < at the end of the day its your bike and your time. my next project is a sfc1000 engine that lost its oil pump drive due to a so call experts engine rebuild.
good look and safe riding Andy
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Thanks.  I had a similar 'expert' catastrophe.  I guess that's why I don't mind getting into it.  I'd rather have it explode because I mucked it up as an amateur, instead of it blowing up because someone else did.
 
Dellortoman said:
Hi Scott

That square bar is not a key. It's part of the clutch actuating mechanism. It goes through the slot in the layshaft perpendicular to the shaft itself, and lifts the clutch pressure plate. The clutch pushrod in the centre of the shaft pushes on it (you'll be able to see where the pushrod has been bearing on it). Or to put it another way, it transfers the force from the pushrod on the inside of the shaft to the clutch hub on the outside of the shaft. When you reassemble it, you need to turn the shaft so the slot is horizontal before putting the bar in, otherwise it'll just fall out again while you're putting the clutch together.
Cam
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Makes total sense.  I was trying to figure out how the clutch was actuated, anyway.  The square bar transfers the load.

Thanks, again.

S
 
Dellortoman said:
Hi Scott

Did you undo the nut on the top of the crankcase? There are about 22 nuts on the bottom but only one on top. It's hiding under the starter motor.

If you're certain that all nuts are off. The case should come apart. Be patient and gentle with it. The gorilla snot may glue the halves together, but it's not a strong bond. Just go around gently tapping with a soft faced hammer until the joint cracks open. Don't wallop it too hard or drive wedges in.
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Yeah, al lot of fasteners.  I'll count them so none get missed.  Haven't undone them, yet.  Good to know the 'glue' is not difficult to separate. Tomorrow.  Had to finish restoring the brake light on my Dad's '41 Continental.  Lots of rust had to be R&R'd.  Besides, it was taking up bench space I needed for Laverda engine splitting exercises.
 
Rockitdoc said:
Yeah, al lot of fasteners.  I'll count them so none get missed. 
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Don't take my count of 22 as correct. My memory is a bit hazy. It might be 24. Earlier 180? engines had a couple fewer than later ones, and I've not had a 120? engine apart so I can't be sure whether they're the same as late 180's.

Anyway, the nuts on the underside are easy enough to find. You'd have to be blind to miss them. You already have the starter motor off so the one on top will be visible too. Make a note of which studs have dome nuts and copper washers, and put them back in the same spot. It's important for keeping the oil in the engine.

Removing the oil strainer and cam chain guide (bottom of crankcase) before splitting the cases is optional.
 
Terry Dymond said:
Yes, they are the ones. Might be discussed when it comes time to re-assemble the engine.
Take note of what Cam said about the clutch actuation mechanism. Spot on.
Terry
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Scott, ask maybe Scott Potter if he could borrow you the tool needed for pre-loading the springs (if he has it), it is way easier with that tool. Still a lot of fettling, but easier...
 
Rockitdoc said:
... and the Green Book doesn't explain this procedure.
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Hi Scott,

Can I please advise you to put the Green Book to one side, and get a copy of the RGS factory manual instead?  I think you'd find many of your questions answered there ...

(Let me know if you can't find a copy on-line and I'll email you a pdf).

Craig
 
Rockitdoc said:
Pre-loading the springs?  Please explain.
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(Is it just me, or is this thread turning into Groundhog Day ...  :o)

groundhog_day_movie-241x300.jpg


Please have a look in the factory workshop manual, Scott, specifically page 64 and the illustrations that go with.

After that:
The utility or otherwise of these springs - and the ease (or otherwise ...) of their installation - has been much discussed on this Forum.  A simple search should turn it up ...
 
Haha.
I cant help but chip in with my 2 cents worth. Those two springs on the back two friction plates work best in the rubbish bin, in my opinion. I removed mine with no ill effect, only benefit.
I wont confuse you by talking of adding a steel plate between them...

Regards, Andre
 
Was saving the spring topic for the re-assembly phase, but as the subject has been bought up: I got rid of the two springs and added an extra steel plate between the two friction plates, as mentioned by Andre. It works for me, no nasty suprises and no extra rattles. I know there has been a lot debate as whether they should be left in or not, up to the individual.
 
I very much doubt if Scott would be able to add an extra steel plate to his clutch pack as his engine has only done 3500 miles from new so there has been no plate wear
there is no room on the clutch hub to add an extra plate until the friction plates wear down a little

 
the two springs - if properyl installed - are to prevent the clutch from rattling when separated.

To install them correctly, the clutch disc package needs to be installed with just slight tension and the rear plate (the one that faces to the engine housing) needs to be turned clockwise a bit (2-3 teeth) so the spring gets under slight tension. This is best done with a factory tool that consists of 2 things: on is a clutch cover with 3 (or 4?) cut-outs and a handle with 2 noses that help you turn the rear clutch plate while you keep the other ones in place with the cut-out clutch cover.

The only thing that happens really if you leave the springs out is that the clutch may (!) rattle a bit when you pull the lever. that's it.
 
Laverdalothar said:
The only thing that happens really if you leave the springs out is that the clutch may (!) rattle a bit when you pull the lever. that's it.
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My RGS rattles like buggery with the clutch lever out. It quiets down considerably when I pull the lever in.
It is a bit better since I recently replaced the primary chains and cush drive rubbers, but still is pretty noisy.
 
The Mk II engines have quite a few sound-deadening features to get them more in line with noise emission laws of the day... one of them are the anti-rattle springs.

To show how effective they are, suspend the empty clutch basket on a finger through the centre bearing.  Give it a tap with a screwdriver, it rings like a bell.  Insert the tensioned clutch plates only, and repeat the tap... only a slight thump to be heard.

The "spider" with the mainshaft outrigger bearing is another attempt at achieving a mechanically quieter motor, as is the far more strongly reinforced primary cover.  The primary chain is the main culprit, causing lots of noise.

Personally, I detest clutches that sound like they were designed in Borgo Panigale. :o

piet
 
laverdas said:
hi rockitdoc, for what its worth I think your doing OK, the thing is every day is a school day and for those of us that have rebuilt laverda engines it gets the heart pounding when you first hit the button. in fact its the best feeling when she cracks in to life. so you carry on and take no notice of the doubters < at the end of the day its your bike and your time. my next project is a sfc1000 engine that lost its oil pump drive due to a so call experts engine rebuild.
good look and safe riding Andy
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The Ark was built by an amateur, the Titanic was built by engineers.  8)
 
'71 SF said:
The Ark was built by an amateur, the Titanic was built by engineers.  8)
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I'll let Henry debate the known abilities of Noah, but surely if God knew as much as they say, he would choose someone capable to build an ark - perhaps even the ancient equivalent of an engineer.  :P
 
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