SFC1000

[Silvaire]

None of that works, for California registration it has to have a 17 digit VIN in the US format. However that’s not true in other US states if it’s over 25 years old - California stubbornly operates in opposition to Federal law and its intent.

 

[1200ts]

The problems with registering an old bike that was not sold new in California are:

Anything made 1978 or newer needs a Federal emissions label which will be under the seat. No label, you are screwed! Even if the bike was sold new in California and has not been registered in many years so no longer in the DMV's computer system, it better have the emissions label as they will look for it. But there are companies that will make you the label. So not a huge problem.

Anything made 1981 or newer needs a 17 digit vin number. As this was a world wide implementation and not USA specific, this should not be a problem regardless of where the bike was sold new. But as I don't know what year other countries started using the 17 digit vin, this could be a big problem?

Some states in the USA do not issue ownership documents for older cars and bikes but only issue a registration card. So providing proof the previous owner did sell it to you and you did not steal the bike can be a big problem. I tried to register a bike I bought in the state of Maine. I had a registration card but no official proof of a sale or prior ownership. After hours at the DMV they called Sacramento who stated that Maine does not issue ownership docs so register it with what paperwork you have.

So in conclusion:

1977 and older - they don't care and will register the bike.
1978 and newer - must have emissions label. You can buy a new label so not a big issue.
1981 and newer - must have emissions label and 17 digit vin. I don't know how you can get around the vin number problem????

And finally if thinking about registering a Harley made before 1970, it can be a nightmare as they don't have a number on the frame.

 

[Silvaire]

Great summary, and I agree with your conclusions.

Thanks.

 

[piranha-bro2]

Bloody hell! What a friggin nightmare!

 

[3CBRG]

In the dark ages in many respects here. Still no facility for vintage reg. One would expect a bit better given it's the 7th largest economy worldwide. Or used to be..

 

[chrisk]

In the dark ages in many respects here. Still no facility for vintage reg. One would expect a bit better given it's the 7th largest economy worldwide. Or used to be..

How do rich flyboys go getting their vintage flying machines registered in the good old USA? Do they have as many hurdles?

 

[Laverdalothar]

The problems with registering an old bike that was not sold new in California are:

Anything made 1978 or newer needs a Federal emissions label which will be under the seat. No label, you are screwed! Even if the bike was sold new in California and has not been registered in many years so no longer in the DMV's computer system, it better have the emissions label as they will look for it. But there are companies that will make you the label. So not a huge problem.

Anything made 1981 or newer needs a 17 digit vin number. As this was a world wide implementation and not USA specific, this should not be a problem regardless of where the bike was sold new. But as I don't know what year other countries started using the 17 digit vin, this could be a big problem?

Some states in the USA do not issue ownership documents for older cars and bikes but only issue a registration card. So providing proof the previous owner did sell it to you and you did not steal the bike can be a big problem. I tried to register a bike I bought in the state of Maine. I had a registration card but no official proof of a sale or prior ownership. After hours at the DMV they called Sacramento who stated that Maine does not issue ownership docs so register it with what paperwork you have.

So in conclusion:

1977 and older - they don't care and will register the bike.
1978 and newer - must have emissions label. You can buy a new label so not a big issue.
1981 and newer - must have emissions label and 17 digit vin. I don't know how you can get around the vin number problem????

And finally if thinking about registering a Harley made before 1970, it can be a nightmare as they don't have a number on the frame.

And they say Germans are over-organized and to bureaucratic...

I am lucky I must say, the local registration office has helped me in the past on several ocasions:
-we bought a house and found a DT125 scrambler in it without papers. restored it with original patina, asked the local officials how to get it registered. At the end, I needed a MOT/TÜV and had to bring a copy of the purchasing contract of the house, stating that everything in the house is sold with the house and had to do a sworn statement that I found the bike in the garage of the house. Done.

-other case: friend here had a hard issue registering a bike that he purchased in Italy with no papers. No local office in bavaria wanted to register it. I told him to sign a contract with me to sell it to me, went to the local officials, told them it was stored up 30 years and now has been re-build and is ready to be registered and - they registered it.

-next one was for another Laverdista who bought a bike in the netherlands. one of the registration documents was missing (there are two). Went to the local office, they said: "No problem, we will send an inquiry to the dutch registration office and once they confirm it is no longer registered in the Netherlands, we will register it." So - we did the Sales contract thing again so I could officially register it under my name, roughly 6 weeks later the confirmation came and I registered the bike and "sold" it back to the owner.

Not sure if it will work like that for ever, but the last cases were really easy. Oh - and for the registration itself, I never had to wait more than 20 minutes to get to the counter (with an appointment though), 20 minutes later I was off with papers and number plate.

 

[pf1]

I once met a guy who made a living bringing small undocumented bikes from Italy, getting them dated and registered in the UK then selling them back to the Italians.

 

[1200ts]

It is not as bad as I made it seem in California. I have about 30 old bikes and have eventually gotten all of the registered in my name. Many had no documents at all or even a license plate. All the issues can be resolved with time and effort. Pre 1978 bikes are relatively easy to register.

But the only problem I don't see a way around is a 1981 or later bike without a 17 digit vin number. As far as I know this is not just a California problem as the requirement for the 17 digit vin was a Federal law and has nothing to do with the states. And many other countries also required the 17 digit vin and now everything has it.

But if you just bought a 1985 Yamaha from Mexico with a five digit vin number, California will not register it ever!

 

[Laverdalothar]

If all it takes is 17 digits, here might be the solution:

The 1000 SFC's VIN on the headstock is:

LAV1000RGS/1*XXXX

That is 17 digits...

 

[The Sock]

If all it takes is 17 digits, here might be the solution:

The 1000 SFC's VIN on the headstock is:

LAV1000RGS/1*XXXX

That is 17 digits...

I'm pretty sure Clem tried that, in the UK, and was told that * was not an acceptable digit.
It's all down to dumb 'puters!
They can't deal with the fact that there's a Laverda 750, out there with chassis nunber 1234, a Laverda1000, a 1200 and an RGS all with chassis number 1234.
So they invented a rule to cover the system deficiencies they bought in.
Remember when computers were "going to help us"?

 

[sfcpiet]

I'm pretty sure Clem tried that, in the UK, and was told that * was not an acceptable digit.
It's all down to dumb 'puters!
They can't deal with the fact that there's a Laverda 750, out there with chassis nunber 1234, a Laverda1000, a 1200 and an RGS all with chassis number 1234.
So they invented a rule to cover the system deficiencies they bought in.
Remember when computers were "going to help us"?

They are... we wouldn't be having this conversation otherwise. Just imagine doing all this with postcards and letters!!

There still may be glitches to be covered, we're still on a learning curve. 'Pooters can be a boon and a bane.

piet

 

[Vince]

Been watching a Doco on misinformation and fake news. I loved the way my internet experience started to allow everybody to link up with like-minded individuals. Before I found the old Guzzi list, I thought I was the only Laverda Tragic in the whole world. So now you find communities, and that's great. But it also linked up dangerously crazy people as well. Add in the profiling and manipulation from the skunk degenerate that developed his rating system for female students from his University and his algorithm, and what's that doing to Western democracies with deliberate maliciousness, and I dont know if it's just turned fully corrupt. Hopefully, with a lifetime of experiences, both good and bad, I hope you can tell good from bad intent. How young people with limited experience do that these days, I have no clue. Educating the masses was supposed to be the fix for propaganda, but that doesn't appear to be working these days at all. Add in AI with its ability to change black to white right on your screen in real time, and we cannot even rely on historic institutions or long-term systems to resist corruption. I really do need to go for a bike ride soon.

 

[Silvaire]

@Laverdalothar the one advantage that California has over Germany and other places is no TüV or MoT inspections for our bikes, and therefore unlimited modification without approval. No official technical inspection has ever been done on any of my motorcycles, ever, since new. So we scurry about making fake emissions compliance stickers to get the bike registered, but nobody cares at that point or forever if the only ‘correct’ thing on the bike is the sticker.

My wife is Bavarian so I’m roughly familiar with the comparison. Neither Germany or California is as good as e.g. Montana or Florida for lack of bureaucracy and reasonable costs, but unfortunately those latter places don’t have so many twisty Alpine roads!

 

[Paul Marx]

Been watching a Doco on misinformation and fake news. I loved the way my internet experience started to allow everybody to link up with like-minded individuals. Before I found the old Guzzi list, I thought I was the only Laverda Tragic in the whole world. So now you find communities, and that's great. But it also linked up dangerously crazy people as well. Add in the profiling and manipulation from the skunk degenerate that developed his rating system for female students from his University and his algorithm, and what's that doing to Western democracies with deliberate maliciousness, and I dont know if it's just turned fully corrupt. Hopefully, with a lifetime of experiences, both good and bad, I hope you can tell good from bad intent. How young people with limited experience do that these days, I have no clue. Educating the masses was supposed to be the fix for propaganda, but that doesn't appear to be working these days at all. Add in AI with its ability to change black to white right on your screen in real time, and we cannot even rely on historic institutions or long-term systems to resist corruption. I really do need to go for a bike ride soon.

Because you think our countries educate our youngsters?
I very much doubt it, they format producers and consumers.
Paul

 

[chrisk]

I’ve got a 81 Jota frame: LAV1 00 * *

Factory replacement frame, hence the numbers

That’ll get the officials scratching their heads come registration time.

 

[Shajota]

I’ve got a 81 Jota frame: LAV1 00 * *

Factory replacement frame, hence the numbers

That’ll get the officials scratching their heads come registration time.

In Qld, regoing old bikes is pretty easy, just need to have your story straight and be careful what you say.........
Had no trouble registering the American Eagle even though no such bike existed on their website but of course it's age meant they had no records anyway!!
Actually was pleasantly surprised at procedures recently when I registered the Guzzi imported from UK. Bike had import approval as a concessional RAV entry (I think over 25years old) and a new 17 digit vin was issued - just glued it on the headstock and good to go. Bloke doing roadworthy loaded it all on the system and Bob's your former Auntie Roberta.
Transport Dept were a bit surprised but with a VIN simply clicked the answers on the computer and asked for the money, all done in a few minutes.
Of course all my bikes have full rego as I do nearly all my riding with all my mates (IE - alone) and don't want any restrictions! So I don't know how it all works with club rego but shouldn't be any harder...........

 

[chrisk]

In Qld, regoing old bikes is pretty easy, just need to have your story straight and be careful what you say.........
Had no trouble registering the American Eagle even though no such bike existed on their website but of course it's age meant they had no records anyway!!
Actually was pleasantly surprised at procedures recently when I registered the Guzzi imported from UK. Bike had import approval as a concessional RAV entry (I think over 25years old) and a new 17 digit vin was issued - just glued it on the headstock and good to go. Bloke doing roadworthy loaded it all on the system and Bob's your former Auntie Roberta.
Transport Dept were a bit surprised but with a VIN simply clicked the answers on the computer and asked for the money, all done in a few minutes.
Of course all my bikes have full rego as I do nearly all my riding with all my mates (IE - alone) and don't want any restrictions! So I don't know how it all works with club rego but shouldn't be any harder...........

Hmmmm, most curious Peter, and just how does one go about getting a VIN number on a black and silver aluminium plate issued?

 

[Cccg]

I think that green SFC1000 maybe my bike? Mine also had the front Laverda emblem removed from the fairing. The Marvic wheels and brakes look like my bike also.

My 1988 SFC1000 was sold new in Germany. The original owner bought a 1200TS to get the vin plate off the frame and took it to Germany and made the SFC1000 a 1200TS to get it in to the USA. The SFC1000 was never sold in the USA.

I also have a full set of all body parts to make the bike orange which was how it was when I bought it from European Cycle Specialties in Southern California in 2002. The wheels and brakes as best I can tell are off a YB6R Bimota. Still have the wire wheels it came with when new.

The black SFC1000 looks like Bob Andren's bike which I think now lives in Australia.

Do you have any more pictures of the green sfc1000?

The black Sfc 1000 looks like the one I recommissioned around 2023. The customer liked it that much he got another Sfc 1000 and a 1200 Anniversary. Both had been sitting in sheds for 20 plus years and required full restoration done by myself at Italbrit Classic Motorcycles.
Very happy customer the end result.
I have his Moto Guzzi Agostini race kitted Mk 3 Lemans in the workshop now.

 

[78jotadave]

1977 and older - they don't care and will register the bike.
1978 and newer - must have emissions label. You can buy a new label so not a big issue.
1981 and newer - must have emissions label and 17 digit vin. I don't know how you can get around the vin number problem????

Yes, older bikes are easy to register in California. My '78 Jota has a 4 digit VIN, I have owned it since June 1982. Annual registration has increased from $49 in 1982 to $174 in 2025, and it will likely rise again this year. But I did look up the value of $49 in 1982, and it is equal to $165 in 2025, so not much of an increase in real value.
And my 78 Jota America has VIN 1200 plus 4 digits. I have owned it since Nov 2022. Neither bike has a Federal Emission label, and the DMV has never asked for one. When I transferred the Jota America to my name, I did all the DMV paperwork at the AAA (American Automobile Association) office, and no one even looked at the bike, even though it was in the parking lot.