Stupidly Thin Control Wires.

V

Vince

Hero member
Has anyone else had Electrical failures with these tiny, very thin, apparently structurally easily broken wiring used in a few EIs? Do they really need to be that thin to flow signalling? Surely it's not weight savings, upping their diameter must improve their ability to take a load or move a bit and not brake and leave you sitting on some remote roadside. Keen to learn.
 
Not sure which wires you refer to, please? If you mean the ones coming from the pickups: they only send a signal to the ignition box (original or digital like DMC). No need for thicker wires and no benefit in using thicker ones. The wires on the pickups f.e. are relatively thin. The only problem they face over time is that the insulation gets britle, which can cause shortings. Thicker wires wouldn't prevent that and thicker does not always mean more durable, as thinner wires are more flexible and can cope with vibrations potentially different/better than thicker ones from theory.
 
Come across it quite a few times Vince, the main reason why I don't particularly like Sachse systems.

May be all right for smooth-running multis, but our harsh, characterfully vibrating clunkers can destroy this type of wiring quickly, especially if no top quality materials have been used and cables are not well supported. Don't know what is currently used on Sachse or Ignitech stuff, but the connectors used in the earlier types also let far too much moisture ingress.

In my experience, poor wiring support creates the most problems, usually only a few centimetres from the ignition unit itself.

The thinner wires are quite sufficient for the low signal voltages that pass through them. Not entirely relevant in our case, but imagine a modern car CAN-BUS system with 3.5km of wiring, if not more, reducing wire guage and overall thickness frees up a lot of interior space and saves quite a deal of weight. Good quality wiring in larger guages can be had with thinner insulation if space saving is a priority.

piet
 
I think my issue was that the cable was 3 times too long than needed between the box and battery, requiring it to be bent back onto itself 3 times with 180-degree bends. I think that's where the intermediate short is. Hope the expert with the proper tool can shorten it and repin it to fit its high-tech waterproof plug.
 
Mmmmmm wires that will meet the demands on a Laverda, for after market ignitions as a guide. The difficulty is suitable quality, there are wires that can meet the requirements, in the iis days that was a UK company called Multicomp ( or BCFF perhaps ) 22AWG at some 6amps with acceptable voltage drop, needing up to six or more wires per harness in protective sheath it adds to the bulk, worse as you increase the gauge.

Quality wire, cost a great deal in the days of iis, there were the odd wire breakage though overall the quality wire did work, over time, with best practice installation methods. Mitigating vibrating wire is a must do. Here is a sample of wire cost, 300m ( 1000ft ) by 8 colors will run you to $1000 plus if you can source a supply at all. HTH j

 
Which ignition has a connection between battery and (ignition?) box that is so long? and for which engine? triple or twin?

Gerald
 
It's an Ingatech on my 3c; every installation is obviously different and a one-off, so generic lengths make sense. My heated grips have way too long wires needing wraps as well. The battery is firmly held by softish water-resistant Poly Stireen packers, a rubber mat and a rubber strap. The Ingacech box is held by Velcro and double-sided tape on the rear plate of the tool tray. And the wires had a couple of cable ties holding them to the frame rails. I guess the 2 180-degree wraps the wires needed were not good. This is a bit of a guess just now, hopefully put to bed soon.
 
If you've got Deutsch connectors, you just cut wires to length and recrimp new connectors. The correct tool isn't crazy expensive and all connectors are available. There are two types of pin crimp for Deutsch pins that are likely to be used with Ignitech setup: fold-over and circular.

As mentioned, reducing the risk of vibration damage is paramount. Silicone on sensor plates and firm attachment of wires to reduce 'flutter'!
 
Especially the battery-cable would be easy to shorten and to put a new connector on, why keep it that long? I assume you mean a Ignitech, not Ingatech, right?
 
Even if you don't have clever crimping tools and the necessary connectors for the Deutsch plugs, you can still safely shorten the harness by simply cutting the excess length out of the middle and splicing back together with a neat solder joint covered with heat shrink. Solder isn't flexible so the splice needs to be in a spot where the cable doesn't need to bend and can be firmly held with cable ties both sides of the splice. If you have a bunch of cables to be shortened, stagger the splices so you don't end up with a bunch of thick joins on top of each other. It may not be the perfect solution but it takes up less space than a messy spaghetti of wires folded back on each other and tied up in a thick clump.

in places where it may not be practical to fix the wires with cable ties (under the timing cover for instance), using a blob of silicone to stick the wires down might be an option.
 
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Causation is not correlation. I am an idiot, AGAIN. Just because I straighten a wire and the bike suddenly doesn't start, I was thinking last night about the last day of The Snowy for me and those mysterious engine stops, and I remembered leaving Gundigi and arriving in Sydney 292kms later. The last 20ks on Reserve and how that resent NO START was with the main fuel taps NOT ON RESERVE. Yep, with it on reserve, it now starts fine. So back to the Drawing Board for those engine cutouts. Gess, you go a long way on Mikuni Carbs.
 
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Oh Vince, you are not the only idiot here... Happened to me, too, this year on the German Forum ride-out... Reached the hotel place on the first day with 180km since last fuel stop. We were not pushing to much on the way down and I had seen 230km on one tank until reserve needed to be pulled, so I was not expecting the tank to be empty really. Bike started next morning faultlessly. People jumped on their bikes and when we wanted to go for the ride, I put in first gear and the engine died. Did not start again and I was really pi***ed... Someone suggested "Reserve?" and desperate as I was, I turned the fuel tabs to reserve, thinking "that CAN not be the solution!". Bike fired up right away...

Sometimes, the problem sits on the bike... 🤷‍♂️
 
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