custom cables

Nipples and soldering is not the problem.

But where to find the best material for wire and cable?

I allways go the the next Hoyakasuki-dealer and ask, if i can have a look at his cable-spare parts.

Then i look for the right thicknes, lenght AND WITH a Teflon or Silikon coating. It makes no difference if the inside or outside is coated.

Then its easy only correct on one end the right lenght and nipple.

Don?t forget to oil/grease regulary the upper nipple at the brake- and clutchlevers, the nipples there have to rotate easy.

So you get a smothy pulling and you will never have the ?fun? of a broken cable.

Thomas aus LAU




 
I made these birds nesting tools from scrap lying around. Venhill sell a tool but it is extraordinarily expensive for what it is (I have seen it close up) in the uk I buy cable making materials from either vehicle wiring products or Carrot Cycles. I use a cheap self heating electric solder pot bought off e bay.
It?s important not to rely on the solder sticking the cable to the nipple, it?s function is to hold the wire strands apart so they can?t be pulled through the nipple. If you make a good birds nest the solder is probably superfluous.
I believe best practice is to use a steel nipple in alloy levers and a brass nipple in steel levers but others may correct me on this. It is also better to use a small pear/trumpet nipple which then fits into a larger barrel nipple for larger cables.
Stainless inner wire is difficult to solder and needs a special flux so I prefer not to use it. Bakers fluid works for galvy  mild steel wires. I?ve had some inner throttle sized cable from Wemoto that is soft and more woven rather than twisted, this didn?t crunch up into a good birds nest and I couldn?t get solder to take to it.
 

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Hey Norm, you've motivated me into having a go at making a birds nesting tool. My birds nesting practice to date has been to tease out the cable filaments with a pointed tool, but it makes an untidy job of it.

To make the grooves in the plates. I'll try clamping them together and drilling down between them. Hopefully the drill will track straight. Just gotta go and measure some cables to figure out what size drill bits to use.
 
Normski said:
I made these birds nesting tools from scrap lying around. Venhill sell a tool but it is extraordinarily expensive for what it is (I have seen it close up) in the uk I buy cable making materials from either vehicle wiring products or Carrot Cycles. I use a cheap self heating electric solder pot bought off e bay.
It?s important not to rely on the solder sticking the cable to the nipple, it?s function is to hold the wire strands apart so they can?t be pulled through the nipple. If you make a good birds nest the solder is probably superfluous.
I believe best practice is to use a steel nipple in alloy levers and a brass nipple in steel levers but others may correct me on this. It is also better to use a small pear/trumpet nipple which then fits into a larger barrel nipple for larger cables.
Stainless inner wire is difficult to solder and needs a special flux so I prefer not to use it. Bakers fluid works for galvy  mild steel wires. I?ve had some inner throttle sized cable from Wemoto that is soft and more woven rather than twisted, this didn?t crunch up into a good birds nest and I couldn?t get solder to take to it.
Click to expand...

Hi Normski!

really nice nesting tool! can you make close up photos of the punches? what makes them special? I guess they are not standar punches...

regarding steinless, there is a special flux to make soldering easy. https://www.bowdenzug24.com/en/shop/tools-and-devices-for-bowden-cable-production/soldering-requirements/loetoel-st-bottle-100-ml-type-fields/
it is really expensive....

when you use a pot for soldering, I guess you need a minimum amount of solder material to cover the nipple when you submerge it, isn't it? when that cools down and come back to solid state, can you reuse it if you warm it up again?

Miguel
 
I too would love to see a close-up of your cool tool (shutup, Chris  8)). I want to solder stainless bicycle brake cable to try with compressionless outer for a clutch - prob gonna be too light but want to give it a crack. I bought special hi-silver solder and special flux that is supposed rto work with stainless but my first attempt was a dud - solder just wouldn't take to the stainless filaments.

Will look for a solder pot and try it that way. But the bird's nest looks the secret to reliable cables to me.
 
Piranha Brother 2 said:
I too would love to see a close-up of your cool tool (shutup, Chris  8)). I want to solder stainless bicycle brake cable to try with compressionless outer for a clutch - prob gonna be too light but want to give it a crack. I bought special hi-silver solder and special flux that is supposed rto work with stainless but my first attempt was a dud - solder just wouldn't take to the stainless filaments.

Will look for a solder pot and try it that way. But the bird's nest looks the secret to reliable cables to me.
Click to expand...

normally you use the high silver content in copper pipes for drinking water and espresso machines

try and see if you can get something like this for stainless
https://www.mcmaster.com/silver-solder/solder-for-stainless-steel/

mcmaster carr should be everywhere!
 
sideshow said:
normally you use the high silver content in copper pipes for drinking water and espresso machines

try and see if you can get something like this for stainless
https://www.mcmaster.com/silver-solder/solder-for-stainless-steel/

mcmaster carr should be everywhere!
Click to expand...

Bewdy Todd. I'll have to look at what I have - I know the flux I got is spesh and the solder I got supposed to be top stuff for stainless - did a stack of reading before choosing - but that McMaster looks the goods.
 
Hi mate, thats just my experience, as i use the high silver gear in my coffee machines. So I could be wrong... I just dont want people getting lead from my coffee!

 
I'm going to have a go at making a birds nesting tool as well now.  I have always just got by with splaying out the fibres of the cable.  Basically what you want to achieve is the solder forming a wedge by bonding to the splayed cable fibres.  That way you not only get full 360 degree solder bond to each cable strand, but the solder also forms a wedge which tightens as the load is applied. The birds nest is a more elegant way of achieving the result.
 
If you haven't got anything better to do. I just fit the nipple over then use my side cutters to flare out the end strands of the inner cable, then the nipple sits well in place when you slide it out to where it will sit. I always check the angle of long (sideways, like into the twistgrip) nipples so that they sit in their place without twisting.
 
The birds nest is the exact same principle used on a colliery winding rope,holding a cage carrying 60 men down a 3000 ft deep shaft,cleaned steel strands,powder resin flux and white metal,It used to be cut off and re-done every six months
 

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Thanks for your interest. I should perhaps have referred to these as bird caging tools not nesting.
I made the first one a few years ago when I needed a shorter cable for an early Laverda brake* than I could buy off the shelf, I?d heard about the tools and was lucky enough to be shown one by a friend so I could understand the idea better.(Earlier this year there was a lot written about these tools in the Old Bike Mart newspaper here in the UK and I picked up a few tips from that)
When drilling the hole I use a drill the same diameter as the cable and I clamp the 2 halves  together with a thin sheet of tin between them, once drilled and with the tin removed the cable will be squeezed enough to hold it without damage. It would be ok to just wrap some tape round the cable if it?s not gripped tightly enough. On my first attempt the drill did wander off but even a wiggly line will work.
It?s best to have some sort of location between the two halves, I?ve used roll pins fitted into an interference hole in one half and a clearance hole the other.
Some people use  angle for the tool, this lets the ?wings? of the angle rest on top of the vice for rigidity when the punch is hit. I just tighten the vice firmly.
You need a countersink in the tool which roughly equates too, but is no larger than  that in the nipple.
Most people put a similar countersink in the punch end but I?ve found it more helpful to drill a hole in the punch end as well, this holds the cable together - you can see the unspread cable above the birdcage in the photo. The punches I use were bought from e bay as a set but they?re softer than the wire and need redressing every couple of cables or so. Any round bar or bolt would do if drilled with countersink and hole.
I found I needed a few practise runs to find the best length of cable to leave sticking out of the tool before punching.
I can?t advise any further about soldering stainless because I?ve had no success when I?ve tried.
I keep the same solder in the solder pot and skim off the slag with a wooden spill/coffee stirrer if some builds up, I don?t think reusing it does any harm.
The soldering could also be done with an iron or fine flame.

Tippie I think by using the tool  there?s more back up strength should the solder fail then just spreading the wires.

* for the threaded adjuster part at the bottom of the inner brake cable I used an Austin Mini front handbrake cable, the thread is 1/4? unf rather than 6mm but it works well.
 
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