Fuel stabilizer for off season motorycle storage

I tend not to trust the claims made by fuel additive manufacturers, whether it's octane booster or stabiliser. If any of that stuff did what it says on the bottle, the fuel companies would already be putting it in the fuel.

Same with oil additives. If they were any good, they'd already be in the oil.

Oil and fuel companies compete for market share. It's to their advantage to give their product an edge over their competitors, so they'll be acutely aware of what differentiates their product from others and what additives are worth using, or not.

Additive sellers are doing little more than peddling snake oil to the gullible. I reckon they rely on the placebo effect to stay in business. People expect it to do something, so they convince themselves that it does, so they keep buying it.

I think fuel and oil additives belong in the same category of bogus products like the fuel "energy polariser" that killed Peter Brock's credibility, or those stupid things that you plug into your cigarette lighter socket to improve fuel economy. Another one of the same ilk was the lumps of lead you could buy to dangle in your tank when unleaded fuel was mandated.
 
When I had a couple of pistons melt silent, apparently Detination from very high compression ratio I went looking at Octane Booster as a fix. They had some kind of controlled test rig that produced Knock, I found an Independent Test on locally available products and out of 10 or so only 2 raised Octane and only 1 made any significate improvement and it was a Nulon product and that only did 2 or 3 points improvement. I think this ended up being sorted with a change of timing and me riding harder.

Pro-Strength Octane Booster (PSOB)

www.nulon.com.au www.nulon.com.au
 
Looking at all the dirt bikes that get put up for winter we noted all the 4 stroke came back after being layed up with green carbs inside and needing serious carb work for the next season. While all the 2 stroke carbs were fine just needing fresh fuel. I've been recommending to the bikes I work on to add 2 stroke oil to tank and slosh it around so all parts of tank are covered. which stope the flash rust and to run the bike till they sure the mix in in the carbs. Those that have been doing this have not suffered from the carb green death. just ride and add normal fuel next season you may have a wisp of smoke for 1/2 a tank but the worst that can happen in you valve guides get oil after being dry all winter.
 
Jugs_S said:
Looking at all the dirt bikes that get put up for winter we noted all the 4 stroke came back after being layed up with green carbs inside and needing serious carb work for the next season. While all the 2 stroke carbs were fine just needing fresh fuel. I've been recommending to the bikes I work on to add 2 stroke oil to tank and slosh it around so all parts of tank are covered. which stope the flash rust and to run the bike till they sure the mix in in the carbs. Those that have been doing this have not suffered from the carb green death. just ride and add normal fuel next season you may have a wisp of smoke for 1/2 a tank but the worst that can happen in you valve guides get oil after being dry all winter.
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Or diesel fuel.
Back to the start of the discussion.

Paul
 
I have seen various 2 stroke chain saw carbs be plugged up with crud if not drained. Maybe the smaller orfices and other fuel pump parts dirt bikes don't have make them more susceptible.

Only a few more years until everything is electric anyway and no fossil fuel is being sold so don't buy shares in gas stabilizer companies. I will be about 94 years old by then and my wheelchair will be orange.
 
My Stihl chainsaw normally sits for months without being used. I never bother to drain the tank when I put it away. It usually takes a couple of pulls on the starter rope when cold, but always starts and runs well.
 
I can only speak from my own experience with fuel stabilizers. I can't offer any opinion if they prevent corrosion when the fuel has absorbed water as where I live we have very low humidity for most of the year so fuel generally never gets water in it.

The problems I have with fuel is where I live in the summer it can get very hot and the fuel wants to evaporate from the fuel tank. I have seen temperature of over 120 degrees in my workshop when it is closed up. This causes the fuel to go bad in a few months. Sta-bil fuel stabilizer does help and I can get a year out of fuel with it. One time when I ran out I tried two stroke oil and it also helps. Every bike I own with a carb gets the fuel drained out of the carb before the bike is put away if it will not be ridden for a few weeks. I also run some of my bikes on aviation fuel which is 100 octane leaded fuel and it does not seem to ever go bad and it has no ethanol in it.
 
I bought these metal balls from some bloke in UK saying they magically stabilised fuel. Thought it so stupid I'd do an experiment... 3 months should be enough in Oz summer in the shed.
 
Diablo Loco said:
I bought these metal balls from some bloke in UK saying they magically stabilised fuel. Thought it so stupid I'd do an experiment... 3 months should be enough in Oz summer in the shed.
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Dunno if this is the case but would these be similar to something called a Fuel Cat which was sold in the UK in the `eighties which were lead ? pellets enclosed in a wire mesh cage...supposed to counter the effect of un leaded fuel that had been introduced around that time .

Chucked one of these into the Mirage tank and had it rattling around in there for about 20 years...wasn`t sure if it prevented valve seat / guide wear as a lead substitute , or helped stabilise the fuel in any way , but it didn`t seem to do any harm either...

Mind you , the Mirage on it`s original 8 : 1`s would run quite happily on the old 2 - star petrol anyway , although I usually went for 3-star .

Only problem I had was when fishing the thing out of the tank after 20 years or so and finding the mesh cage was starting to break up , bits of wire floating around in there wasn`t ideal obviously , so I took it out and put another one in there for the next 20 years or so , remembering to keep a check on it`s condition every now and again this time ....

I believe the original thinking behind this dates back to WW2 when the UK leased Hawker Hurricane fighter planes to the Russian Airforce .
Reports came back from the Russians saying that they were having engine troubles so Rolls Royce sent one of their chaps out to investigate , and he found the Russians were trying to run the planes on paraffin or something , so he came up with the idea of introducing these pellets into the fuel line to help the combustion process.....

Could be complete nonsense of course but I like to believe it...
 
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rocketonarail said:
Could be complete nonsense of course but I like to believe it...
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Yep. It's nonsense. If the lead pellets had any chemical interaction with the fuel (which they must have to actually do anything) then they would be changed or consumed in some way after 20 years. Sounds like the only thing consumed was the wire mesh cage.

The "lead" in fuel isn't metallic lead. It's tetraethyl lead, TEL or Pb(C2H5)4, an organic compound of lead produced by a complicated chemical process. That process is not reproduced in the fuel tank, so metallic lead isn't going to magically turn itself into TEL when you dump it in the tank.

TEL is nothing like lead. For a start it's a colourless liquid. Chemical compounds have very different properties to the elements they're composed from. For example, chlorine is a horribly poisonous gas and sodium is a metal that reacts explosively with water. Both are dangerous substances and you'd be mad to ingest either of them. But when chemically bonded to form sodium chloride (NaCl) it's just harmless table salt. You can sprinkle it on your food and eat it.
 
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Dellortoman said:
Yep. It's nonsense. If the lead pellets had any chemical interaction with the fuel (which they must have to actually do anything) then they would be changed or consumed in some way after 20 years. Sounds like the only thing consumed was the wire mesh cage.

The "lead" in fuel isn't metallic lead. It's tetraethyl lead, TEL or Pb(C2H5)4, an organic compound of lead produced by a complicated chemical process. That process is not reproduced in the fuel tank, so metallic lead isn't going to magically turn itself into TEL when you dump it in the tank.

TEL is nothing like lead. For a start it's a colourless liquid. Chemical compounds have very different properties to the elements they're composed from. For example, chlorine is a horribly poisonous gas and sodium is a metal that reacts explosively with water. Both are dangerous substances and you'd be mad to ingest either of them. But when chemically bonded to form sodium chloride (NaCl) it's just harmless table salt. You can sprinkle it on your food and eat it.
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Oh well it was a nice idea while it lasted...
Above by the way are the things I was on about .
At least it was cheaper than going for an unleaded head conversion which was all the rage at the time ; if these things were doing bugger all then having that done would have been a completely unnecessary expense as the Mirage ran perfectly well through the `eighties , ` nineties and noughties and `tens .
I reckon it could be down to a sort of placebo effect...if you believe something useless is working then everything is fine , the bike senses you feel fine so it feels fine as well...☺️
 
rocketonarail said:
Dunno if this is the case but would these be similar to something called a Fuel Cat which was sold in the UK in the `eighties which were lead ? pellets enclosed in a wire mesh cage...supposed to counter the effect of un leaded fuel that had been introduced around that time .

Chucked one of these into the Mirage tank and had it rattling around in there for about 20 years...wasn`t sure if it prevented valve seat / guide wear as a lead substitute , or helped stabilise the fuel in any way , but it didn`t seem to do any harm either...

Mind you , the Mirage on it`s original 8 : 1`s would run quite happily on the old 2 - star petrol anyway , although I usually went for 3-star .

Only problem I had was when fishing the thing out of the tank after 20 years or so and finding the mesh cage was starting to break up , bits of wire floating around in there wasn`t ideal obviously , so I took it out and put another one in there for the next 20 years or so , remembering to keep a check on it`s condition every now and again this time ....

I believe the original thinking behind this dates back to WW2 when the UK leased Hawker Hurricane fighter planes to the Russian Airforce .
Reports came back from the Russians saying that they were having engine troubles so Rolls Royce sent one of their chaps out to investigate , and he found the Russians were trying to run the planes on paraffin or something , so he came up with the idea of introducing these pellets into the fuel line to help the combustion process.....

Could be complete nonsense of course but I like to believe it...
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These things are about the same size but lighter than lead, appearance of a harder iron alloy. Like ball bearings... :rolleyes:
 
Tippie said:
And now if you take them out of the tank the placebo effect will be gone and you will be in big trouble.
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When going green lane / trail riding I remember a bloke who used to carry a used / empty Finilec foam tyre repair cannister with him on the bike in the belief it warded off punctures.....much more effective than a new one....

And then there was Carl Fogarty`s orange tee - shirt....

And Gary Lineker saying that whenever Paul Gascoigne played for England he would always make sure he was the last out of the dressing room and flick the light switch on / off fifteen times before making his way to the pitch....it`s all in the mind you know....
 
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rocketonarail said:
Dunno if this is the case but would these be similar to something called a Fuel Cat which was sold in the UK in the `eighties which were lead ? pellets enclosed in a wire mesh cage...supposed to counter the effect of un leaded fuel that had been introduced around that time .

Chucked one of these into the Mirage tank and had it rattling around in there for about 20 years...wasn`t sure if it prevented valve seat / guide wear as a lead substitute , or helped stabilise the fuel in any way , but it didn`t seem to do any harm either...

Mind you , the Mirage on it`s original 8 : 1`s would run quite happily on the old 2 - star petrol anyway , although I usually went for 3-star .

Only problem I had was when fishing the thing out of the tank after 20 years or so and finding the mesh cage was starting to break up , bits of wire floating around in there wasn`t ideal obviously , so I took it out and put another one in there for the next 20 years or so , remembering to keep a check on it`s condition every now and again this time ....

I believe the original thinking behind this dates back to WW2 when the UK leased Hawker Hurricane fighter planes to the Russian Airforce .
Reports came back from the Russians saying that they were having engine troubles so Rolls Royce sent one of their chaps out to investigate , and he found the Russians were trying to run the planes on paraffin or something , so he came up with the idea of introducing these pellets into the fuel line to help the combustion process.....

Could be complete nonsense of course but I like to believe it...
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Keeps rust off the inside of the tank by rattling around.

Paul
 
rocketonarail said:
At least it was cheaper than going for an unleaded head conversion which was all the rage at the time ; if these things were doing bugger all then having that done would have been a completely unnecessary expense as the Mirage ran perfectly well through the `eighties , ` nineties and noughties and `tens .
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I'm pretty sure Laverda valves and seats were OK with unleaded fuel. No conversion was necessary. My 1976 Jota is still on its original valves/seats and is still running fine, as is my brother's 1975 3C. I guess people who had conversions done were influenced by the publicity at the time saying lead free fuel would ruin engines. Maybe that was true for some engines, but Laverdas seem to be OK.
 
Dellortoman said:
I'm pretty sure Laverda valves and seats were OK with unleaded fuel. No conversion was necessary. My 1976 Jota is still on its original valves/seats and is still running fine, as is my brother's 1975 3C. I guess people who had conversions done were influenced by the publicity at the time saying lead free fuel would ruin engines. Maybe that was true for some engines, but Laverdas seem to be OK.
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Exactly. I rebuilt my S at the turn of the year 2000 and had lead free seats fitted by Phil Todd who did the crank.
All the others that are running are standard and see a lot of use.

The current scare is ethanol content. Buy shares in companies making additives. There's a scare every 20 years.

Paul
 
rocketonarail said:
View attachment 67021

Oh well it was a nice idea while it lasted...
Above by the way are the things I was on about .
At least it was cheaper than going for an unleaded head conversion which was all the rage at the time ; if these things were doing bugger all then having that done would have been a completely unnecessary expense as the Mirage ran perfectly well through the `eighties , ` nineties and noughties and `tens .
I reckon it could be down to a sort of placebo effect...if you believe something useless is working then everything is fine , the bike senses you feel fine so it feels fine as well...☺️
Click to expand...
I remember the vehicle research institute testing these and found they did nothing & they were withdrawn from sale and bike dealers were advised not to sell them. They have re-emerged as an eBay special ..still don’t work.
Magnets attached to fuel line also don’t work- the same magnets also don’t cure your ageing dog from arthritis or stop hard water from chalking up your kettle. The soft valve seat scare when unleaded was introduced also was unfounded- loads of old vehicles not affected - interestingly, only bike I have ever seen significant seat recession was on Yamaha five valve head 1000 EXUP but this may have been caused by tight clearances and prolonged high revs.
 
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