Proof of ownership

Exmoor beast

Exmoor beast

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Location
Minehead,Somerset, ENGLAND OF COURSE
I’ve just gone through the teeth pulling of dealing with the DVLA- I’ve done this a few times recently and have learnt how to deal with them. My V5 turns up, all good but written on the front is “ this is not proof of ownership..” so I’m left wondering -What is?
Various motoring organisations suggest a V5 is proof of ownership but DVLA don’t want that sort of legal responsibility.
I bought my scooter from a farmer, history is it came from a bloke in part ex along with two other vehicles for a classic Jaguar.
It had a Greek ( Athens) number plate but no paperwork. I would imagine this lack of history & paperwork is a similar story for a lot of barn finds/ incomplete projects . Now,my Scoot is relatively worthless but if you were in possession of a car or bike that’s worth a lot could someone make claim to it being stolen etc in 1977? I also applied for a V5 for my Cagiva as it had been lost by previous owner- they sent it through to me no problem- I didn’t need to supply photos or anything else.Seems a strange set up- I have ownership deeds for my house why not for my bike?
 
This probably doesnt help, but i think the v5 wording is to distinguish between the keeper (with legal responsibility) and the owner where they are not one and the same. E.g. finance company or employer for company cars. Unlikely to be applicable other than to new vehicles. In the case of separate owner and keeper there will be some form of contract. I have been the 2nd owner of a few ex-lease cars and there has been no documentation frome the leasing company provided, only the HPI check.
 
RobinSF1 said:
This probably doesnt help, but i think the v5 wording is to distinguish between the keeper (with legal responsibility) and the owner where they are not one and the same. E.g. finance company or employer for company cars. Unlikely to be applicable other than to new vehicles. In the case of separate owner and keeper there will be some form of contract. I have been the 2nd owner of a few ex-lease cars and there has been no documentation frome the leasing company provided, only the HPI check.
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The “keeper” is an interesting one- it’s a term seemingly only used by the DVLA. As you correctly say the Keeper is the one responsible for taxing etc not necessarily the legal owner. Very odd situation - wonder how the law sees this in terms of deceased estates etc, could a relative take back a vehicle that wasn’t theirs?
 
I had company cars when in my early 20's and they were never registered to me, but the company that employed me, never even got tricky when going abroad, I just typed out a letter stating that I had permission to do that, but thought it best to get signed by a senior party with (obviously) a different name and title to me)

when self employed and then running my own outfit, the vehicles were always registerd to the company (G P C Engineering Ltd) tax reasons and block insurance reasons not to mention the depreceating asset aspect over many years. The accountant hated that, I ran my Land Rover for 30+ years, repairing when neccesarry, but never giving up, a totaol of 385,000 miles from the original build date. And 25% depreciation every year plus 100% of repairs as we went along, although I think the rules have changed now, anyone remember the old Landy towing the caravan to multiple Laverda rallies with TOG on the rack between the two? that never did my children any harm at all, mooching with adults at a very early age.

I was recently asked by a government body (blue badge) to give them sight of my birth certificate (the original not a copy) this was for indentification purposes, and on the bottom of said certificate is printed in red, "this document is not proof of identity" so what is then?
CLEM
 
CLEMTOG said:
I was recently asked by a government body (blue badge) to give them sight of my birth certificate (the original not a copy) this was for indentification purposes, and on the bottom of said certificate is printed in red, "this document is not proof of identity" so what is then?
CLEM
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I'm not convinced that birth certificates are worth the paper they're written on. I've never had an original birth certificate, only an "extract on search" which doesn't list the names of my parents, and has my name spelled incorrectly, so it's pretty useless for official transactions. Whenever any Government pen pusher has asked to see my BC, I just tell them I don't have one and offer some other document as evidence of ID. It's never been too much of a problem when dealing with officialdom, even when applying for a passport, so I've never bothered sourcing a proper birth certificate from the Registrar of Births, Deaths and Marriages. I presume the incorrect spelling is in their records anyway. The earliest document I have with correct spelling is a baptism certificate from when I was about 3 years old, which is a bit ironic as I'm an atheist. But it's served the same purpose as a birth cert for the last 70 years.
 
Doing probate through the NSW Supreme Court after a death, Mandatory with any real estate, requires original documents and does that open a can of worms? Suddenly you have info that contradicts long-held either non-disclosed or conflicting info names especially, even my own. I have for the last 60 years spelt my middle name with 2 Ns. It surprised me to find it with one N on my birth certificate which is now different to my licence passport and bank records. My Mother was known as Betty her whole life till my insane father's mother insisted it couldn't be as it must be Elithabeth as Betty is its short version so she was married as Elisabeth and that started a 60-plus year nightmare up past her death about her correct name. Now you know why that insane comment happened. So don't expect any Government record to be as you expect. I have found multiple differences back in time doing probates, Lots of fun ordering birth and death records required to get that done.
 
Blimey Vince, your family sounds as crazy as mine when it comes to names. My first names are Matthew Cameron, but I'm generally known as Cam, not Matt. It's the Matthew that was incorrectly spelled on my birth record, with only one "t". Who the hell spells Matthew like that?
I'm not the only one in my family that's generally known by their second name. My father and sister went by second names too. My mother was called Sarah but was always known as Sally. Gawd knows why. All this arse-about name business is a pain in the arse when dealing with official crap. When I worked for the government, I had two superannuation accounts in different names. It almost took an act of parliament to get back the money that went into the incorrectly named account.
 
its common in the UK royal family as well, Prince Harry was christened Henry.

I have a birth certificate dating back a century and half that incorectly spells my familly name three different ways on the same piece of paper, as well as the correct one which is CLEMANS.
Buffalo Bill Cody had an afair with an English woman when he visited UK with his travelling circus around the turn of the century (1900) her name was Viola Katherine CLEMONS, (one of the incorect spellings on that CLEMANS birth cert) she bore him two sons, who are both surnamed CLEMANS, one of them emigrated to America, the other stayed in the UK
CLEM
 
CLEMTOG said:
its common in the UK royal family as well, Prince Harry was christened Henry.

I have a birth certificate dating back a century and half that incorectly spells my familly name three different ways on the same piece of paper, as well as the correct one which is CLEMANS.
Buffalo Bill Cody had an afair with an English woman when he visited UK with his travelling circus around the turn of the century (1900) her name was Viola Katherine CLEMONS, (one of the incorect spellings on that CLEMANS birth cert) she bore him two sons, who are both surnamed CLEMANS, one of them emigrated to America, the other stayed in the UK
CLEM
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Are you telling us you are in fact Buffalo Clem? 🤞
 
Exmoor beast said:
The “keeper” is an interesting one- it’s a term seemingly only used by the DVLA. As you correctly say the Keeper is the one responsible for taxing etc not necessarily the legal owner. Very odd situation - wonder how the law sees this in terms of deceased estates etc, could a relative take back a vehicle that wasn’t theirs?
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Yes they can. When my dad died I sold his car to a dealer (before probate was granted, though theoretically shouldn't have). I had the V5 in my dad's name, had already informed the DVLA he had died. Showed the dealer the death certificate which they took a copy of and I signed a letter saying I was entitled to sell it. Money paid direct to my account.
 
I had a slightly different scenario in that I was the registered keeper of a wheelchair adapted van that was paid for by my demented mother, so was technically the legal owner, but she wasn’t allowed to drive it as the DVLA had removed her entitlement to drive. We used it to take her out and about. When she died I sold it to a friend, and like you before probate was issued, but the cash was paid into the exec account rather than my own, which I get a share of anyway.
 
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