The new 4 valve cylinder head for Laverda triples is now available

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Jens said:
These are also my thoughts, Marnix,

and I am always very happy the see, what all is done in the Laverda community.

So much passion, nosiness, experimenting and liveliness.

Superb, Gijs!


An amazing achievement,congrats Gijs

Shaun
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I didn't critisize it. I think it's a great accomplishment. In my country, you cannot registrate and legally use such a bike, as it has changed it's character. It's not the power, but the change from carburettors to injection. A new 160% tax on the kit and the bikes value would be demanded by state. Further, it would need two examples to be run at the technological institute incl. crashtested. So in total a really expensive thing to do. But none the less a great development. I'll certainly be looking forward to some test sooner or later.
As Lothat said, a modern lambda sonde to manipulate and prove exhaust gasses, would be needed to get any sort of street legality in at least my country. Would I like to have it? Yes.

What I meant with my comment is that such much more power will demand other parts to be upgraded as well. Nothings for free or come easy. But they are doable. E.g is special made much superior gearbox internals made for my Esprit, so it can handle up to near 700 Hp. Which it doesn't have and if it did, would put a lot of strain on the chassis and many other parts. But I still had it made and it was costly. But doable. So would the remaining Laverda parts be.
Interesting news and well done.

Kind regards,
Jacques
 
Very Interesting endeavor that those guys are up to!!  A really outstanding engineering effort in every way!!  By the way, I emailed them and asked about heads and cylinders for a twin, they replied and said no plans at all.  Dang!
 
Lovely Expensive! I don't think there's a market for this considering Suzuki came out with a 11000rpm 4 light valve DOHC Hemi head 4 Cyl design in the mid 70's for 1/2 the cost of a Breganzie 7400rpm heavy 2 Valve Hemi Triple.

Giving the Breganzie Triple another 2000rpm - Will the bottom end hold together ?

I'm sure the tranny will hold out but what about the crank ?

I think in search for higher rpm's for a Breganzie  DOHC Triple (or even a SOHC Twin for that matter) with a cheaper solution would be to use ultra light valves, true guides and a stiff valve spring.

You want hit and hold over 7400rpm and up to 8000rpm with an old Breganzie - Pay attention - I'm sure this thread is going somewhere ;o)

Definitely a revolutionized part for a Breganzie Triple.

Granted you really can't work on a Suzuki engine because they are made of Saw Dust.
 
andre g said:
but I wonder why 4 valve Guzzis are according the rules????
Andre
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Correct, most if not all classic Ducati and Guzzi racing bikes (and also most japanese bikes) use modern engine components since many years.
 
Looks very impressive. I suspect that this is a path that most will not follow. However individual parts (e.g. barrels or fuel injection) may be applied without going the whole hog I suspect.

What about reproduction of standard 2-valve heads? May have a bigger market.

Cheers,

bazzee
 
It is extremely interesting that the EELC (European Endurance Legends Classic) strictly outlaws these type of modifications but as was mentioned before the Guzzi seems to be allowed!
Maybe it just squeezes into the period window in certain classes. 
However, If Gijs has decided to make it all then I am fairly sure he has a plan of somewhere to race it, maybe in the EELC or elsewhere,  For instance in the IOM the classics are open to the organizers interpretation of their own rules and they allow what they like in order to make a good meeting, I think this is a good idea when there are never enough classic bikes out there anyway. 
Fair play to Gijs and God speed him to a win!

Would be fun to have an absolutely stock looking Jota or 3c at a track day hogged out to "big" and fitted with the 4 valve head etc (but on carbs of course) and upset the modern boys What a laugh that would be!

Julian 
 
I was thinking the same, Q bike. No, not that Melbourne Q bloke but a sleaper hiding in plain sight. Turn up at a club night with a std looking RGS, I would prefer a 3c but it would be hard to hide it, with this gear under the bodywork. I really need to get out for a ride.
 
MarnixSFC said:
My goodness, was unware of this being seen as a competion. Bit sad really.

Grant Van Dijk his moment of glory.. please!

Marnix
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I agree with Marnix,  its a pretty amazing creation, all the work and testing that has gone into this is phenomenal. I mean why wouldn't you do it if you can. Its the sort of thing John Britten would be proud of. I have never been one to keep a bike standard, if it isn't 100% original,  and  I think my 1200 will go this way, I cant imagine why anyone wouldn't applaud Gijs's  passion and brilliance.  Luckily there are still countries in the world where we can modify bikes and ride them like this, and fortunately I live in one, so Im going to be in line for this!

Onya Gijs!
 
make no mistake,  I want one! just need to know a lot more about it, and I wouldn't put it on an existing engine or into an existing bike, oh no! it would have to be buy the kit, and scratch build the engine, then build the bike around it, maybe a special frame kit if one is still, available, or commission one, or (best of all) get my son Tom to make one.
CLEM
 
"However, If Gijs has decided to make it all then I am fairly sure he has a plan of somewhere to race it, maybe in the EELC or elsewhere,  For instance in the IOM the classics are open to the organizers interpretation of their own rules and they allow what they like in order to make a good meeting, I think this is a good idea when there are never enough classic bikes out there anyway. "
They are going the other way here, trying to take the racing out of classic and make it a fucking parade class. The new rule introduced - with mass disbelief from just about all the Norwegians I know who race other than the modern classic classes- by the organising committee for nordic classic is from this year if the engine and frame did not leave the factory together they are not allowed. So all the things people did back in the day like Norvins, Tribsas and all the rest are banned. No mention of special frames like all the Rob North and Seeleys. They are chasing all the competitors away. Who votes in these representatives that work against us? It sounds like politics. Soon it will be just CBRs and GSXRs etc. Spit spit.
 
MVma said:
I reckon that I was hoping for more enthusiastic comments on what is undoubtedly one of the most remarkable developments for our machines.


Even if it's a very different case, all that reminds me the discussion about the Laverda/Aprilia SFC 1000. I always thought it was a fantastic and well-designed machine. No matter that it was a disguised Aprilia, Ivano Beggio had the panache to propose this renaissance of Laverda through one of the most beautiful (and efficient) motorcycle projects of the 2000s and I found it too unfortunate that the comments from some Laverda enthusiasts were not more grateful for this unique effort to revive our favourite marque.
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Hello JLO,

I think there is a LOT of apreciation from all of us for the afford Gijs (and others?) took to make this development. It is for sure a bit of human nature to have the second thought like: "is it something for me" just followed by "what would it take and what would it cost me to change my engine. And that is where maybe reality hits enthusiasm a bit.

I personally take the comments all positive(inclucing mine, please) even though some argue the cost, the necessaty or sense of such a project. It is more with their personal background (including mine) with the question: "does it make sense for ME?". And in most cases the answer will be "No" unfortunately.

what are people willing to pay for such a solution? How much more is it compared to modifying a 2-valve engine to similar power? Until real numbers are available, a lot of discussion and personal points of view will be aired, thats for sure.

To compare it with the "Laverdaprilia" is - from my point of view - very much undervaluing what Gijs did. For me still the Laverdaprilia was nothing than a Mille RR Factory with orange paint, a special frame and some Laverda stickers. I can not see how this has anything to do with Laverda, aside of the color and the stickers, please?!?

Gijs on the other side took the old engine to a modern state and it is by far the biggest development and afford and deserves the same respect as Cor Dees re-creation of the 2 V6 in my eyes.

Maybe we should give Gijs and team some time to set the machine up, do some fine-tuning and have a second machine modified with the modified crank and see what can be achieved. That might take the discussion of price and sense of it all to a different level, too.

My 2 cents.
 
Tippie said:
They are going the other way here, trying to take the racing out of classic and make it a fucking parade class. The new rule introduced - with mass disbelief from just about all the Norwegians I know who race other than the modern classic classes- by the organising committee for nordic classic is from this year if the engine and frame did not leave the factory together they are not allowed. So all the things people did back in the day like Norvins, Tribsas and all the rest are banned. No mention of special frames like all the Rob North and Seeleys. They are chasing all the competitors away. Who votes in these representatives that work against us? It sounds like politics. Soon it will be just CBRs and GSXRs etc. Spit spit.
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Simple answer to that,
Start another club,  That's been done many times before and will happen many times again.
Gather up some followers and go for it!

Julian
 
I've asked Mr Milyard to build to build me a three cylinder 12 valve bike by sticking together 1 and 1/2 Laverda 500s.
Stay tuned.

Paul
 
Which is what the factory should have done themselves.
A 750 triple would have been a good basis for a new range of engines, most of the development work already done.
 
I wonder whether you've been following this, Red?!  :o  And tossing a few ideas around in your head .... hmmm, the mule with all hard work done already ... with a nice little 4-valve head ... in the Scorch frame ... prime candidate!!
 
Julian, to compete in the Nordic series all the countries meet and agree on things by vote. The Norwegians were outvoted. Most entrants are riding the later stuff anyway now, the "old" classes are shrinking and getting lumped together with several classes on track together. Times move on. A shame though that small mindedness thwarts the tinkerers who want to put interesting combinations together, just as was done back in the day. Doesn't affect me with my SF2.
Yes a 180deg twin cam triple 750 using 500 stuff would have been great.
 
I have followed this thread initially with some disbelief and then relief as the scope of Gijs and his teams achievements have sunk in.

The good news is that I already have a 4-valve per cylinder 120deg 1000cc engine with fuel injection.
I have to report that it has great torque, is very smooth and economical, extremely reliable and revs great! I love it and might buy another!

Oh alright, it's under the bonnet of my Toyota Aygo!!!!!

Seriously though, well done indeed!!!!!!
 
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