RGS Frame

andre g said:
171 kg is a good weight but 108/ 63 is not a fine balance, you think it is real???
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I agree Andre, the bike doesn't feel light at the front. I haven't ridden it hard yet. I was curious whether wheighing each end in turn is an accurate method. The bike has to go for annual M O T test soon and the axle weight is displayed (with rider to apply brake) during the brake efficiency test. I will make a note and post.
 
Weighing each end with the other end packed up to horizontal is how I always did it. Seems to work.171kgs is bloody impressive.
 
Vince said:
Weighing each end with the other end packed up to horizontal is how I always did it. Seems to work.171kgs is bloody impressive.
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Really sorry about the quality and copywrite etc but this article makes reference to a similar bike, owned by a fella with a nice voice and bad haircut
 

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simwoo1009 said:
Really sorry about the quality and copywrite etc but this article makes reference to a similar bike, owned by a fella with a nice voice and bad haircut
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The story says the bike is 27% lighter than a stock Jota.

If a stock bike weighs 234 kg according to Wikipedia then 27% lighter means it weighed 171kg!

If a stock Jota weighs 250kg according to Google, then 27% lighter means it weighs 182.5 kg!

A couple of coincidences?
 
The frame of the Laverda itself is a heavy lump. I compared once the Motoplast-Frame with swing-arm installed and came to something like 15 Kilos IIRC. The Laverda-Frame itself weights something like 21 Kilos - plus swing arm... so there alone is at least something like 5 - 8 Kilos to be found. Where else you strip away 40 Kilos though on a road-ready bike puts some questionmarks to me, especially as at the time the article was done, LiFePo4-batteries were not available, so no chance to safe another 10 Kilos there (compared to the very large Fiat 500 battery the Laverdas had ex factory)...
 
Hi Lother.

That's why you have to buy 1 Spaceframe frame from me, it weighs 11 kg, I mean my Spaceframe weighs 190 kg at most, and I haven't done anything to trim it down, can quickly find 20-25 kg special motor parts, Titanuim axle and brackets and bolts, special battery etc., my 1974 racer weighs approx. 200, I would also be able to trim it down by 20 kg, now I have sold it for a Laverda friend.
 

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78jotadave said:
There is no way the bike weighs in at 171kg is that your estimate or your goal? Robjotas race bike weighed 183kg and his motorcycle was seriously trimmed down. How did you lose another 12kg, tossing the battery and starter motor?
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I haven't needed to think about it before, but now it seems I do. Take a look at the differences from a std Jota, starting at the front.​
  • Cast iron rotors onto alum carriers & spacer rings and 15 fasteners per side versus Spondon stainless floating discs 6 fasteners per side
  • Stainless front mudguard and tubular hoop bracket (earlier bikes) versus flimsy fibreglass and alum fixing plate & 4 alum spacers
  • Marzocchi 38x830 forktubes versus 40x750 GP Forcelle - Forcelle probably similar weight or heavier due to adjustable preload and quick release knuckle at spindle
  • 4mm ~ lockstop plate and oil cooler hanger versus 3 pc stainless arrangement onto lower yoke and folded 1mm alum oil cooler bkt
  • Chrome plated tube and triangular steel headlight brackets with rubber block and fasteners versus 2 alum rings & stainless wire bracket +3 fasteners
  • Mild steel (20swg ?) headlight bowl versus plastic item
  • Mild steel (20swg ?) petrol tank versus 7075 (?) alum alloy
  • Mild steel (20swg ?) stucture for solenoids, rectifier & Bosch igniters, within a Mild steel (20swg ?) battery tray with hinged plate + rubber strap versus 25 swg stainless 3 sided box that tightly contains battery and those electrical items bolt to it via AV mounts
  • 2 silencers and 3>1>2 collector box versus minimalist 3>1 system attached by 3 springs & 1 AV block
  • Mainstand assy versus adapted sidestand
  • Steel swingarm versus Spondon alum item
  • 2 Marzocchi remote reservoir shocks versus 1 DeCarbon unit
  • Rearset footrests attached to frame via alum castings versus bolted direct to frame
  • Stainless steel rear mudguard versus fibreglass
  • Plastic sidepanels & badges versus none
  • Chrome plated steel grabrail vesus none
  • Pillion footrests + fasteners versus none.
This is just from memory so I haven't weighed anything (apart from the finished bike) but to add perspective take an objective look at the last item on the list. Everything out of Breganze was chunky and weight saving wasn't priorotized in the way in would be in the post-Fireblade era. None of this is a critisism, they are great bikes that have stood up well to the passing decades, built to last with timeless looks. The Spondon tubular frame was amongst the last before they switched to the extruded beam or large dia tubular material.
 
sfc vintage said:
Hi Lother.

That's why you have to buy 1 Spaceframe frame from me, it weighs 11 kg, I mean my Spaceframe weighs 190 kg at most, and I haven't done anything to trim it down, can quickly find 20-25 kg special motor parts, Titanuim axle and brackets and bolts, special battery etc., my 1974 racer weighs approx. 200, I would also be able to trim it down by 20 kg, now I have sold it for a Laverda friend.
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Thanks, but I will be selling 2 bikes at least this year and want to continue to reduce, not expand... ;-)
 
Hi Lothar.
Re: type of Laverda, I myself am about to sell out of my small collection, here in Denmark EVERYTHING has stopped selling classic motorcycles, plus prices are at rock bottom, my plan is to get down to a maximum of 2 bikes
 
simwoo1009 said:
I haven't needed to think about it before, but now it seems I do. Take a look at the differences from a std Jota, starting at the front.
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Could you please put it on a scale that weighs the bike? Not this nonsense of front wheel then rear wheel that is so inaccurate. Go to any decent shipping company DHL (Cargo) or even AA Cargo services. Pretty much any 'Freight Forwarding Company',, has a scale that you can weigh a motorcycle on both wheels at the same time, duh!
I have 'freight forwarded' (Shipped) a Harley, to a mate, may he now RIP, to Perth (Western Australia) a 1974 Norton, 2 Triumphs and 2 Beemers (BMWs), and a 1978 Ducati to a mate in Adelaide South Australia. Each time these forwarding companies had available and insisted on weights from a scale where the whole bike was on the platform. Try the FF Companies they will weigh them for free, at least the companies in Long Beach California do. I've also shipped ' Freight Forwarded' 2 Jeeps, an 82 Mustang, a 76 Firebird (Pontiac), and a shitload of auto parts (that make up a whole vehicle). To be honest, if the vehicles fit in a container it is not an issue, but they weigh them anyway and give you a printout. Parts are always weighed and unless you have a full container you are charged by weight.
As a side note a mate of mine in South Australia who received several shipments from me had to pay customs duties on the value of the crates I built to ship the bikes in, MFs. Australia is tough to ship to.
There is no weigh, haha your bike weighs less than a 1974 Ducati 750 SS Bevel, Cook Neilson 'True Blue' lop off a cylinder, and then it's a maybe.
Let us know what your final weight is, it is of interest.
The easiest (cheapest) way to trim weight from your Laverda be it a Twin or Triple is to go on a diet, haha!
 
Of course Dave, I'll get my helmet on and get across there straight away. Maybe. Not. The Spondon frame is thin-walled, bronze welded chrome-moly with a typical 22mm Dia, not 3.5mm mild steel like the Laverda frame (as Andre pointed out at the start of this thread.) A huge weight saving there (otherwise why do it) That, along with the list of 'differences' that I listed (forgot the airbox) makes my figure credible.

I think Roger Winterburn is on the forum. Roger originally supplied this and a few others through his Windy Corner outlet in the UK.Perhaps Roger would like to comment. . .

In the meantime lighten up, Dude
 
simwoo1009 said:
I'm late to this thread, but just for reference I weighed my road-going Spondon Jota using the same method and similar kit as Robjota. I'm probably going to become unpopular . . 171kg as pictured
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I don't believe your stated weight of 171kgs, weigh both ends together and post up then

my race bikes weigh in at 175kg, with oil, no fuel, with a 51% front, 49% rear weight bias
no starter system, lightened crankshaft, lightened primary drive, no head lights, no horns, no charging system, no mud guards, no gauges apart from a lap timer
Carrillo conrods, Ross Racing pistons, they have chrome moly frames, wall thickness 1.4mm, 17" Marchesini rims, 17" slicks, alloy fuel tanks, Titanium axles and bolts/nuts/studs all over them, Lithium batteries, everything is stripped back bare
if I could find a way to lose more weight I would but nothing left to lighten

sorry but I do not believe your Spondon weighs in at 171kg, my bikes are built only to race so no road going kit on them at all



DSC_0665 2024-09-15 VRRC, BEARS, Phillip Island

D50_3582 2022-09-03 VRRC Phillip Island
 
I hear you Red & respect your authority and that of others here. I started by explaining how I weighed each end and expressing reservations about the accuracy of the method. I wheeled each end onto the same set of scales and steadied the bike in the vertical. I dont recall if the other wheel was chocked up to the same height as the scales - probably not. I did this 2 years ago for my own benefit. I discovered the mag article more recently. When the bike is back together I will put scales under both wheels and post. Attached are the 2 pics from then.
But, Spondon were no duds either, they built a solid reputation with their race frames in the '70s and were only killed off by Stuart Garner's Norton fiasco. I'm happy to concede when I'm wrong, but let's reserve judgement just yet. Is there a Mr Roger Winterburn in the house??
 

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Interesting convo ... very hard to see another triple coming in under Red's racers - as he said, if there was anywhere else to lose weight, it would have been done.

Looking forward to the final pre-fight weigh-in :ROFLMAO:
 
I don't know how common or accurate they typically are around the world, I expect the Government Weights and Measures bunch to check them as they charge a fee per kgs of rubbish but I recently weighed my Atlas fully fueled up on my local council rubbish tips vehicle weighbridge. Very easy to do. After reading Atlases weighed 150kg and being hopeful, it actually weighed right on 200 kg, that's with 25 litres of fuel on board. Petrol weighs 0.47kgs per litre so that's 11.75kgs, so dry that's 188.75kg. Google your local weighbridge.
 
I hear you Red & respect your authority and that of others here. I started by explaining how I weighed each end and expressing reservations about the accuracy of the method. I wheeled each end onto the same set of scales and steadied the bike in the vertical. I dont recall if the other wheel was chocked up to the same height as the scales - probably not. I did this 2 years ago for my own benefit. I discovered the mag article more recently. When the bike is back together I will put scales under both wheels and post. Attached are the 2 pics from then.
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maybe check the scale for accuracy... ;-)

What really wonders me is the big difference between front and rear. But also the fact that it's road-ready, to my understanding without massive engine lightening work etc. .. The engine itself weights something like 90Kgs if unmodified... so....

The only possibility really is to go the scrap yard or a transportation company that has a scale that is accurate enough to weight at least on a kilos base. Put it on there and see what happens. but don't be to disapointed...
Vince said:
I don't know how common or accurate they typically are around the world, I expect the Government Weights and Measures bunch to check them as they charge a fee per kgs of rubbish but I recently weighed my Atlas fully fueled up on my local council rubbish tips vehicle weighbridge. Very easy to do. After reading Atlases weighed 150kg and being hopeful, it actually weighed right on 200 kg, that's with 25 litres of fuel on board. Petrol weighs 0.47kgs per litre so that's 11.75kgs, so dry that's 188.75kg. Google your local weighbridge.
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Fuel is actually 0,74 Kgs/Liter according to my google results, so 200 minus 18,5 = 181,5 dry.
 
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